A bit of advice: I'm all about giving a teamkillers a good thrashing, but doing so in an organized vigilante manner is bound to cause you guys some unintended consequences.

I think your focus is too broad, and on too many controversial issues that many of the most senior players here do not agree on. Because of this, moderate minded players are going to see you guys as Dogfight's version of the Spanish Inquisition.

What issues do we all agree on? Team killing and over the top foul language/ overtly sexual remarks etc. Thats it.

So, focus on these items and you will continue to recieve support from the general Dogfight community. Start hunting every person that's accused of spawn killing, camping, blah blah blah down and my $5.00 says Zuperman will shut you down himself.

Just my unsolicited advice
Take it or leave it

Jacklpe

I don't take getting raped while just spawning and just starting to roll to take off. I was killed 5-6 times by Dreadnought as soon as I started rolling on the carrier in dogfight game mode.

Getting sick and tired of getting spawn/base raped.

I do not know if these two have made the list ( guess I could look but to pissed right now) but add MIG 29 and Dreadnaught. Martin witnessed.

madmax2069 wrote: I don't take getting raped while just spawning and just starting to roll to take off. I was killed 5-6 times by Dreadnought as soon as I started rolling on the carrier in dogfight game mode.

Getting sick and tired of getting spawn/base raped.

Annoying, yes. But how are your brakes?
If memory serves, dreadnought has been reported for bannable offenses as well, love to see a moderator act on that if I am remembering right.
Manfred

Since I am knee deep anyway why not plunge in. Now I will admit I may not know all of what everyone has been doing but I will say what TASK means to me and what the rules should be in my opinion. I am agree with almost all views posted here. Should TASK go around teamkilling spawn killers and potty mouths...no. Should it be a relentless killing spree...no. The whole point is to turn and rehabilitate players with bad habits in a more confrontational way, like it was posted before, they ruin our games so we ruin theirs.

This is still a new idea and it's hard to have control and know the best way to act. Some believe this list should be a 'kill instantly' list, while I like what Blue Max said in that he uses the list to know what a certain player has been known to do and watch. If that player does the same bad act they are told and punished and told again. This is believe is the way to sway those who will be swayed. They get the association that their acts produce consequences, they may be trolls, some of them, but no one likes to be outplayed and laughed at.

So I say if not TASK then what? Why not change this into a force of good and define what it is we all want? The fact we have a list of these players is value enough in my eyes in that we know who not to fly in front of or when you get clipped and no reds are in sight if that was really an accident.

Here are my ideas for improvement of TASK
-Team killing has the same rules as always...only in retaliation, once, then switch sides. So the scenario would be like this, if a known team killer is in the game observe them. If they hit a blue or are shooting at a blue and you can stop them hit them. Now tell them they are on the TASK list then switch sides and pummel them. When they go down ask if they want to still act like that, rinse repeat. By always being red you can do your teaching with the blessings of all of DF and show we don't get down to their level.

-Spawnkillers should never be team killed and only shot mercilessly. The debate on spawning has been beaten to death and I say we all know what is really right and wrong. There are no pilots on the TASK that are light on the spawn killing. These pilots are seasoned players who do this as a game tactic. While there is no rule against it, there is a courtesy in that it's not very hard to hit planes barely airborne. You can discuss it all you like but guys like Kero Zen and Lowenhardt have made it a part of their game and so all I say is we no longer extend the courtesy for them, they will be hit sitting on the runway or not.

-Potty Mouths I think really belong more on the blacklist since I don't know what shooting them down does other than make them spew more filth.

-Membership for TASK. Let's post the people who are part of TASK so it is clear who is in and who is not and if TASK can be blamed for poor acts.


So to summarize having a list of players with their bad habits is a great asset. Having a group of people who help try and make DF better by trying to school the TASK List players also an asset. This is meant to be a group of highly respected players who dish out death to those who deserve it most, within the regular rules of the game, until they get tired of going down in flames. I say let's not criticize lets build what it is we want since there is good here it's just losing it's path.

So.....spawnkilling is to be accepted?
Does this mean jumping in a tank at enemy base to combat that is accepted?

I'm sick of SKers..nothing we can do about them.
I just got SKed 3 times in a row by Duggie camped over base in BtB mission.

Spectre-Blackstar wrote: So.....spawnkilling is to be accepted?
Does this mean jumping in a tank at enemy base to combat that is accepted?

I'm sick of SKers..nothing we can do about them.
I just got SKed 3 times in a row by Duggie camped over base in BtB mission.

I don't know if this was intended for what I posted but I say no, SKers should be spawnkilled just the same as they do to others. The idea is we get many people into TASK and they make these players see why what they do is ruining the game.

SnidleyWhiplash wrote:

Spectre-Blackstar wrote: So.....spawnkilling is to be accepted?
Does this mean jumping in a tank at enemy base to combat that is accepted?

I'm sick of SKers..nothing we can do about them.
I just got SKed 3 times in a row by Duggie camped over base in BtB mission.

I don't know if this was intended for what I posted but I say no, SKers should be spawnkilled just the same as they do to others. The idea is we get many people into TASK and they make these players see why what they do is ruining the game.

Ahhhh---thanks, Whip.
"Police our own!"

Ok after reconsidering the importance of task, Im back. I like the new inputs/clarifications Whip. I just like to add, although we've been very careful so far, in the interest of easing some minds, it is worth reiterating that we don't just task anyone on a hearsay...we have never been liberal in jumping the gun so to speak and we should never list anyone based on one complaint. As mentioned before, to make it to the list, there should be multiple complaints. The offenders are usually pretty obvious to most and those Emmy Award winners on the list are creme de la creme of offenders...indisputable dirtbag criminals who need to learn, that kind of behavior will not be tolerated. We are not setting any rules here nor do we have the power to...just sick and tired of game ruiners running off scotch free.

I was just in a very good game, evenly matched when here comes SCOSSER shooting off his potty mouth not only to me but others

Well he eventually left but as for the game, it was never the same. Many left.

When I started 8 months ago i remember an occasional bad one, now its every day.

ZUPERMAN created a great game, the inaction of being able to ban or task these creeps are taking its toll on players and the game.

Davy Crockett wrote: I was just in a very good game, evenly matched when here comes SCOSSER shooting off his potty mouth not only to me but others

Well he eventually left but as for the game, it was never the same. Many left.

When I started 8 months ago i remember an occasional bad one, now its every day.

ZUPERMAN created a great game, the inaction of being able to ban or task these creeps are taking its toll on players and the game.

While I agree they are scum I don't see how potty mouths can be dealt with by TASK. Everyone I have met up with seems to be a pretty poor player and seems to just want to spew filth and nothing can stop them. I say the correct place for that is the blacklist and get them muted. See spawn killers and team killers have to stop to deal with us, potty mouths can just keep going and the more you feed them the more they spew.

Davy Crockett wrote: I was just in a very good game, evenly matched when here comes SCOSSER shooting off his potty mouth not only to me but others

Well he eventually left but as for the game, it was never the same. Many left.

When I started 8 months ago i remember an occasional bad one, now its every day.

ZUPERMAN created a great game, the inaction of being able to ban or task these creeps are taking its toll on players and the game.

Yep,
Goes to show, you can't fix stupid.

Dixieconfederate wrote:

Davy Crockett wrote: I was just in a very good game, evenly matched when here comes SCOSSER shooting off his potty mouth not only to me but others

Well he eventually left but as for the game, it was never the same. Many left.

When I started 8 months ago i remember an occasional bad one, now its every day.

ZUPERMAN created a great game, the inaction of being able to ban or task these creeps are taking its toll on players and the game.

Yep,
Goes to show, you can't fix stupid.

Actually you can (but not in game), but its sort of illegal (unless its justified).

I don't spawnkill. Period. If im going to the base, i loop and come in from the side. If its a zep, i wait till they shoot. I don't see the need for sking, and if i see someone doing it relentlessly against the enemies, i will ask them to stop. If they don't stop, I will shoot them once, tell them why, ask again. If they still don't stop, I finish them off.

Teamkillers and foulmouthed players are generally 9-12 year old who think they run the game. To put them in their place, and depending on how bad they are, I might harshly tell them to stop or teamkill them.

Dixieconfederate wrote:

Davy Crockett wrote: I was just in a very good game, evenly matched when here comes SCOSSER shooting off his potty mouth not only to me but others

Well he eventually left but as for the game, it was never the same. Many left.

When I started 8 months ago i remember an occasional bad one, now its every day.

ZUPERMAN created a great game, the inaction of being able to ban or task these creeps are taking its toll on players and the game.

Yep,
Goes to show, you can't fix stupid.

Darn right Jack! Still, with all Si Robertson references aside, we ban Rich AND his wife, but not these relentless teamkillers and potty mouths? Not trying to start arguments over this, just pointing it out.

SnidleyWhiplash wrote: Since I am knee deep anyway why not plunge in. Now I will admit I may not know all of what everyone has been doing but I will say what TASK means to me and what the rules should be in my opinion. I am agree with almost all views posted here. Should TASK go around teamkilling spawn killers and potty mouths...no. Should it be a relentless killing spree...no. The whole point is to turn and rehabilitate players with bad habits in a more confrontational way, like it was posted before, they ruin our games so we ruin theirs.

This is still a new idea and it's hard to have control and know the best way to act. Some believe this list should be a 'kill instantly' list, while I like what Blue Max said in that he uses the list to know what a certain player has been known to do and watch. If that player does the same bad act they are told and punished and told again. This is believe is the way to sway those who will be swayed. They get the association that their acts produce consequences, they may be trolls, some of them, but no one likes to be outplayed and laughed at.

So I say if not TASK then what? Why not change this into a force of good and define what it is we all want? The fact we have a list of these players is value enough in my eyes in that we know who not to fly in front of or when you get clipped and no reds are in sight if that was really an accident.

Here are my ideas for improvement of TASK
-Team killing has the same rules as always...only in retaliation, once, then switch sides. So the scenario would be like this, if a known team killer is in the game observe them. If they hit a blue or are shooting at a blue and you can stop them hit them. Now tell them they are on the TASK list then switch sides and pummel them. When they go down ask if they want to still act like that, rinse repeat. By always being red you can do your teaching with the blessings of all of DF and show we don't get down to their level.

-Spawnkillers should never be team killed and only shot mercilessly. The debate on spawning has been beaten to death and I say we all know what is really right and wrong. There are no pilots on the TASK that are light on the spawn killing. These pilots are seasoned players who do this as a game tactic. While there is no rule against it, there is a courtesy in that it's not very hard to hit planes barely airborne. You can discuss it all you like but guys like Kero Zen and Lowenhardt have made it a part of their game and so all I say is we no longer extend the courtesy for them, they will be hit sitting on the runway or not.

-Potty Mouths I think really belong more on the blacklist since I don't know what shooting them down does other than make them spew more filth.

-Membership for TASK. Let's post the people who are part of TASK so it is clear who is in and who is not and if TASK can be blamed for poor acts.


So to summarize having a list of players with their bad habits is a great asset. Having a group of people who help try and make DF better by trying to school the TASK List players also an asset. This is meant to be a group of highly respected players who dish out death to those who deserve it most, within the regular rules of the game, until they get tired of going down in flames. I say let's not criticize lets build what it is we want since there is good here it's just losing it's path.

I agree.

I will still shoot down a mouthy one. Most often I rib them pretty hard. They will usually leave after you make them look stupid. I will shoot them down a few times in between.

I will still be teamkilling the douchestache aka. --pain-- that is personal.

If these guys don't rate a ban and continue then I say kill them every time you see them. Such as Dylan Sing and EE Orange. They have had there chances.

This is the way I've played since I started and I will continue.

I forgot to add this.

Have fun, enjoy the game, enjoy yourselves, and the guys you like to play with. TASK if you want or don't, whatever floats your boat.

Fighting on the forum is a tireless and needless thing. Every one here has a different take on whats right and wrong. My views and game play are well documented here and ingame. They will remain the same. The forum can be an aggravating place if you allow it to be. Don't let it. Fighting with each other over turds is insanity. Pure craziness.

I will try and get in a game tomorrow and cross my fingers that it doesn't involve a game ruining turd. Since my game time will be cut down now I may lean towards the harsher side of TASK, who knows. It sure seems lately that the game is over run with ass holes and phantoms. So much so its causing problems between good and honorable forum/game members. Now that's something to think about.

Stay thirsty, my friends

Why don't they just make it so you CAN'T team kill. That's how Storm Raiders is set up. That's why they don't have these types of problems. If the designers had common sense, they'd have done that a long time ago!

I suggested this a long while back. Blues shouldn't be able to kill blues. Blue hangers should be immune to blue bombs. Blue carrier is already this way. I would eliminate all of this in one update.

Yeah, a lot more improvements will have to come about before I'll ever start playing this game again.

-jman70- wrote: Why don't they just make it so you CAN'T team kill. That's how Storm Raiders is set up. That's why they don't have these types of problems. If the designers had common sense, they'd have done that a long time ago!

Blue Max Young wrote: I suggested this a long while back. Blues shouldn't be able to kill blues. Blue hangers should be immune to blue bombs. Blue carrier is already this way. I would eliminate all of this in one update.

This has been suggested in the past, and I'm not sure it's a good idea. The ONE important thing that being able to shoot blues does is it allows the possibility of inadvertent friendly fire. My fear of shooting a teammate is the one thing that keeps me from just blasting into a cloud of red that has a blue or two in it. There are high-rank server "noobs" who are Jerry Seinfeld "close standers" and shoot a little too close over my shoulder. These guys leave no maneuvering room for the blue in front of them. Some will never learn, but some do get feedback and learn to leave some room for their teammate to do a little shake 'n bake out there. The feedback comes from clipping a teammates wing or blowing them out of the sky.

Without that friendly fire capability, this game would turn into a blast 'em up cheap video game, instead of a dogfighting simulation.

IMO.

Manfred

Manfred, you have a point. I agree that imunity to blue weapons would make it a little "cheap".

BUT

If simulation is what we want, we wouldn't have WW2 tanks; and tanks would act less like being made of paper.
That being said, it is clear taht simulation is not the goal of this game.

So, I believe that making blue planes/hangars imune to blue bullets/bombs should stop all this drama - it would be a good trade-off (being a little "cheaper", but making it less complainable).

(Hope my horrible English dont prevent me to be understood here...)

But.... After the immunity for planes takeing off was added we had planes fly all the across and bomb before they would take a hit. Some still do. There seems to be a growing number of banne hins here lately. That's when you get a group of people that start bitching about a little thing and bitch it into a big thing. We all have our on ideals on how to handle these issuers so handle them and leave the pecking to the chickens......

Even a barbed wire fence knows how to deal with most of these issuers





I'm just saying...

I will always shoot down a red plane or red enemy in whatever game I am and will do my best to not ever leave a game unless its battery, life out of game reason, etc.

I've heard the blue on blue immunity suggestion before and tend to agree with Manny. However, I think a compromise on this would be better than what we have now. In general, teamkillers are a nuisance. I might get shot down once in a game with a TKer, but I can't remember the last time got me more than that. As soon as they show themselves for what they are we as a whole deal with them. This disrupts the game but doesn't completely ruin it. Once they start taking out hangars, they have truly impacted the game.

I say keep friendly fire and make the blue hangars immune to blue bombs and tanks.

ParrotHead wrote: I've heard the blue on blue immunity suggestion before and tend to agree with Manny. However, I think a compromise on this would be better than what we have now. In general, teamkillers are a nuisance. I might get shot down once in a game with a TKer, but I can't remember the last time got me more than that. As soon as they show themselves for what they are we as a whole deal with them. This disrupts the game but doesn't completely ruin it. Once they start taking out hangars, they have truly impacted the game.

I say keep friendly fire and make the blue hangars immune to blue bombs and tanks.

Yep. (That's all I have to say about that.)

So how do you guys feel about those who drop their bomb in a lopsided game, was in btc just now 5 reds against 2 of us blues and a well known player dropped his bomb came to our carrier and kept taking us out when we barely got of the deck.
In an even game that wouldn't normally bother me but with 5 to 1 I say its a crap thing to do.

Flyingmuck wrote: So how do you guys feel about those who drop their bomb in a lopsided game, was in btc just now 5 reds against 2 of us blues and a well known player dropped his bomb came to our carrier and kept taking us out when we barely got of the deck.
In an even game that wouldn't normally bother me but with 5 to 1 I say its a crap thing to do.

That's exactly the kind of player I like to go after. At that point, I do not care about winning the game, I will just focus on frying his azz over and over again. Kero the Zero gets the wrath of Noush every time. Loewenhardt will often go down in flames but he'll manage to get me every now and then if there are more reds involved in the chase. KAF1 I'll usually out snipe before he gets close enough...the fool still hasn't learned, but will usually chase for a while before I Noush him too. Fortunately, those who can kick my azz are all good guys and never have to worry about them.

Edit: For clarification purposes, this isn't a TASK related issue. Just my personal preference.

Flyingmuck wrote: So how do you guys feel about those who drop their bomb in a lopsided game, was in btc just now 5 reds against 2 of us blues and a well known player dropped his bomb came to our carrier and kept taking us out when we barely got of the deck.
In an even game that wouldn't normally bother me but with 5 to 1 I say its a crap thing to do.

Well to me this is more of a Name and Shame type behavior IMO. TASK is for pure scum and the lopsided games are the real issue that should be addressed. For example I normally enjoy the hunt for people who sneak bomb and I sneak bomb myself but not when I am on the 7 in a 7 vs 1. So is sneaking like that wrong? Since there is no way to defend this type of play should we do something to compensate? I say we all (if you are not already) try to reduce the complaints to the number of actual problems. Not to say your complaint isn't valid it is, I just don't see that someone should have TASK after them for it. The uneven games makes a whole mess of undesired situations, like camping and dropping to sk, but it is all really one issue. Tank spawn killing is a problem. Relentless spawn killing in plane is a problem. When I say this I mean that this is how you play your game. For example if in a ctc and what you do is fly to the enemy base and wait for spawners that is a problem. The Windows 8 phantoms are problems.

I hope this doesn't sound harsh I am just a bit defensive since TASK seems to be receiving a lot of ridicule and I am trying to define what it is we do here. We shoot down the scum that we all hate in an attempt to sway them to be more respectful. If that doesn't work at least they will be dealing with us so you all can play normally. I would have expected the bomb droppers to sign up for TASK and put their skills to use. If you just want to go around shooting everyone why not have a good purpose behind it.

Fair point at the end there Whip.
And Noush seems you already have the one in your sights, Loewenhardt, I asked him if he was carrying and what got me was he straight out said no, none of his side where even close to our carrier I told him it was a low thing to do in such a lopsided game, he just carried on, I quit.