I like the new way Zuperman has it set up.
Level 9 and under on one server and 10 and up on others. (Is that right?)

It makes for good cleaner games without seeing so much preying on noobs. The teams seem to even out more since you don't get one side loaded with low ranks.

I wonder how things are going on the lower server. I read that some squads were sending scouts in on new accounts to check out the potential recruits. This may spark some new revenue for the game makers? I just hope experienced pilots aren't just going wild in there.
Any reports?

Yeah, lots less teamkilling it seem.

Segregating the skill levels was a great move.

I like it a lot!!!.....I also like the way the point system is too.....everyone is able to gain more points and not lose them when you crash etc....Great job zup!!!!

Splendid, no more team killing!
I miss the tutoring and helping the newbies.

Lol i had wondered why it was always air marshals lol

its,segregation..its ilegal..let em fly with higher ranks..so we can climb faster by killin em. The noobs,n low ranks wont mind plus they will be tking themselves..without us to keep them in check,you will have many to leave...plus its fun to school a tk.what?? i got a bad conn most of the time, i ned every edge i can get .

I think it's going to make it a lot harder for a new guy to get any amount of skill for a while... I much prefer jumping right into the fire. But, most folks like everything easy, so it'll probably be a hit. Woe to the poor soul that graduates and thinks he's good though... He'll be in for a shocker.

legendofkane wrote: its,segregation..its ilegal..let em fly with higher ranks..so we can climb faster by killin em. The noobs,n low ranks wont mind plus they will be tking themselves..without us to keep them in check,you will have many to leave...plus its fun to school a tk.what?? i got a bad conn most of the time, i ned every edge i can get .

Lolololll.....That was funny......
Also I wish you were a mod again

Jacklpe wrote: I think it's going to make it a lot harder for a new guy to get any amount of skill for a while...

.
They won't be as battle hardened...yet. Those who went through before the split were sent strait into battle against all ranks with only the most basic of training. Think of what the aspirant faces as they spawn into a Capture the Carrier mission;

They have never seen carriers. *
"There is a point on the little map that i need to find".
If they have sucessfully completed all of the training missions they may have been required to successfully land only once.
It can be a serious challenge to fly under the bridge. They still need to learn how to fly the plane.

Now that they are not spawning into games of higher levels they are not comming in with desperate questions, TK-ing and tank SK-ing when higher levels are in a serious game.

A level 8 or 9 should be able to help with any pointers. A level nine may also have the drive to get into the Big Leagues and have figgured out how to earn points quickly. Some will be aching to get into battle and feel like they're ready!

.

Jacklpe wrote: I much prefer jumping right into the fire. But, most folks like everything easy, so it'll probably be a hit. Woe to the poor soul that graduates and thinks he's good though... He'll be in for a shocker.

Actually, IMHO, talent is showing by level nine. Quite well in some. They may pull off some amazing stuff running on pure adrenaline! And then in the same minute accidently bomb their own hangar. (yea. that was me, )

Since shooting down higher ranks is now worth more than lower ranks, it may take longer to level up in the early stages. What a rite of passage it must be.

Here's the point you folks seem to be missing. We need those people or this game may be done. When we were all together most people joining the game were wiped out before they even learned how to fly. In turn they left never to come back or buy the game....(BUY THE GAME)....Thats the key words here. Zup needs funds to improve what we have much less build a new game. So YES it was the right thing to do and a good ideal.

I think that all the teamkillers are going rampant in the low rank games, because no higher players are telling them to stop and no one knows to report them. They will be making up their own rules since most don't know about the forum and have no higher ups to guide them. And people can be good at low ranks. I was recruited for enigma at rank 5, and have seen many great players with amazing potential at lower ranks. I think they are missing out on experience and are being babied so that when they join real games they are at a disadvantage.

I agree with Dave.... What the hell am I saying?!?!?

Yes, I really agree with Dave. The separation will get more new players hooked and they will buy the game.

I do have some concerns...

Do they even know they're segregated? Do they know they will "graduate" into the "big leagues"? Like Jack said, it may be a huge shock when they do. I think the coach idea was a good one. I know Zup is working on better guides or tutorials, but the rules and objectives are not intuitive. I mean, I know one guy that went 700 kills and 1 hangar bombed. Why? Because it isn't real clear. I can imagine 6 or 8 level 1-3s in a CTC and having NO IDEA what they're supposed to do.

Secondly, are these guys being moderated at all? 99% of the stuff that is reported is by more senior players and some new guy that doesn't know what we won't tolerate. Those reports are almost ALWAYS after multiple warnings are given by the senior guys. Theoretically, a new new guy can now get to level 10 before he's clued in on proper game etiquette. How many new folks are these turds running off with somebody to throw a flag on the field? I see problems coming from this.

PH

Ok the Bird made a good point, but what we need is a fix not a buffet for the higher ranked spawn killers, Any ideals on how to keep them separate but teach them as well? Maybe letting a few higher ranked players join their Rain Deer games with the understanding it's to help not just to clear the sky's. Finding that players going to be just as hard to do I'm afraid.

Big man hug to you too Dave, with two thumps on the back...

When Z announced this several players volunteered to fly in the little leagues as "coaches". I think most of them even agreed to fly with blanks or limited weaponry.

I think I may even start a "coach" account. I can afford the extra $5 and might even be fun. When that one hits level 10, I could start over. Coach PH... I like it.

What better way to learn to fly than from a Bird... just watch the droppings would ya...

How about creating an "Instructor" Squadron.
Volunteers would have to start a new account.

Xxx Instructor xxX

In addition to all of the "conduct yourself honorably" stuff the rules could include:
Do not shoot unless shot upon and first aptly warned.

There would be no motivation to shoot. It would only make you level out.
I suppose it may take moderator controls to manage the jerks.

There may need to be a dedicated part of the forum. Sounds like a lot of work.



Thanks to all of you who do so much to keep it all going as it does. Hopefully the pains will be because things are growing.

Well they do need to know what's waiting on them behind door #2 when they rank up, I think the moderators would be a good fit u/no take turns in there....teaching killing talking letting them know the hell that awaits them behind the green door yes I saw that movie. anyway... Yes they need some interdiction to the higher ranks and the game in general and a moderator could do that.

Ahhhhh...didn't realize that change was made.

Now I know I'll NEVER make MORAF (much less full ACM).

Oh, well, I guess I'll just keep on bombing (in both senses of the word).

McFate wrote: I like the new way Zuperman has it set up.
Level 9 and under on one server and 10 and up on others. (Is that right?)

It makes for good cleaner games without seeing so much preying on noobs. The teams seem to even out more since you don't get one side loaded with low ranks.

I wonder how things are going on the lower server. I read that some squads were sending scouts in on new accounts to check out the potential recruits. This may spark some new revenue for the game makers? I just hope experienced pilots aren't just going wild in there.
Any reports?

i made a new account since my old one wasnt working.(long story.) but i was in lower ranking server and some were pretty good. others just couldnt find out how to play though.(usually you can ask higher ranking players, but i helped them when i could.) but other then that,its much better!

When it first started it seemed like there was a glitch since I seemed to be on the + lvl 10 side with another Air Marshall and we had six reds no higher than lvl 3!!! I felt bad it was a noob feast. There were so many of them you had to work really fast but many don't evade at all at that level so it was one after another going down. I haven't had that since the first day and maybe it was coincidence. The big questions I have is once they hit level 10 and get on the big server will they stay long enough to be able to keep up? I guess the idea is they would be hooked by then...

I think that if I were just starting out now I would like the segregated servers. Once players attain a certain level of skill, they go face new challenges rather than slaughtering noobs.

Nothing was more discouraging for me as a noob than some hotshot wiseacre showing up in his UFO and blasting me to smithereens at the spawn point.

A few months ago my daughters, both avid gamers in their early 20s, gave Dogfight a try. Both quickly gave up after being endlessly spawn killed.

When I was a noob I preferred going up against less proficient players when I was learning the basic features of the game. I learned a lot by watching other players, by reading the forum and by playing the practice missions. I didn't need some Air Marshall holding my hand. I was perfectly content to see the mission objective stated ("First to destroy enemy's base wins!" or "Defend the Zeppelin"), then figure out how best to do that as I went along.

It was nice to get an "Attaboy" from other players, regardless of team or rank, and I think hat's part of the culture of the DogFight community. Whether or not it exists in the noob servers, it awaits them at graduation to the major league.

I would hope that the Moderators have the ability to drop in on the noob servers and tell us what's going on in that slow-moving universe.

Regarding the quality of players emerging from the noob servers, I'm pretty satisfied. They put up a good fight, seem to know what's going on within the scenarios and really don't trash talk. So cheers to Zup!

SnidleyWhiplash wrote: The big questions I have is once they hit level 10 and get on the big server will they stay long enough to be able to keep up? I guess the idea is they would be hooked by then...

I'd say YUP

Same thing here with my kids junk and 3 friends, but I still think its a good ideal but they do need teachers of sort

I am using an old account (PHOTOPLANE) level 2 to help the new folks. I don't shoot or bomb. Check the stats. I just help with tactics, objective, manners and direction to the forum. When they realize that I am not there for the points the questions come fast and furious. Some are very funny!
They seem to appreciate it.

I got a reply from Z on his original announcement thread. He's ok with a training squad, just not any additional programming. Currently the mods are limited by their rank as well. I think I'll start the training squad. I'll put out the rules for trainers on the squad page, but lets get some suggestions rolling. Who's thread is this anyway? Do you mind if we high jack it for this?

I'll take that as a no. If you're bothered by it, lemme know and I'll move it elsewhere.

So, throw out you're suggestions... I'll start by saying i don't think we should just be bystanders. We should actively play the missions, but in a subdued way. From anyone's experience in Rookies Day, its a given that we'll already be limited by available planes. Maybe that's the way to limit our impact on a given game. Rookie planes only. I do think its worthwhile for them to learn how to defend against capable, albeit handicapped players. We'll fly a tag that identifies us a coaches. I think we should refrain from any squad recruiting, making it neutral squad-wise. Offer tips, give advice, demonstrate will be the main goal. Anyone joining will have to purchase another account. I also think we should use a variation of our current name so that we are recognizable to them once they graduate and also to any other coaches. Limit coaches to 1 or 2 per game, no more than 1per side or per game.

Again let me know your thoughts. Are you interested? Is this a bad idea? Suggested guidelines?

PH

ParrotHead wrote: I got a reply from Z on his original announcement thread. He's ok with a training squad, just not any additional programming. Currently the mods are limited by their rank as well. I think I'll start the training squad. I'll put out the rules for trainers on the squad page, but lets get some suggestions rolling. Who's thread is this anyway? Do you mind if we high jack it for this?

I'll take that as a no. If you're bothered by it, lemme know and I'll move it elsewhere.

So, throw out you're suggestions... I'll start by saying i don't think we should just be bystanders. We should actively play the missions, but in a subdued way. From anyone's experience in Rookies Day, its a given that we'll already be limited by available planes. Maybe that's the way to limit our impact on a given game. Rookie planes only. I do think its worthwhile for them to learn how to defend against capable, albeit handicapped players. We'll fly a tag that identifies us a coaches. I think we should refrain from any squad recruiting, making it neutral squad-wise. Offer tips, give advice, demonstrate will be the main goal. Anyone joining will have to purchase another account. I also think we should use a variation of our current name so that we are recognizable to them once they graduate and also to any other coaches. Limit coaches to 1 or 2 per game, no more than 1per side or per game.

Again let me know your thoughts. Are you interested? Is this a bad idea? Suggested guidelines?

PH

I think all of your ideas are good ones.

ParrotHead wrote: I got a reply from Z on his original announcement thread. He's ok with a training squad, just not any additional programming. Currently the mods are limited by their rank as well. I think I'll start the training squad. I'll put out the rules for trainers on the squad page, but lets get some suggestions rolling. Who's thread is this anyway? Do you mind if we high jack it for this?

I'll take that as a no. If you're bothered by it, lemme know and I'll move it elsewhere.

So, throw out you're suggestions... I'll start by saying i don't think we should just be bystanders. We should actively play the missions, but in a subdued way. From anyone's experience in Rookies Day, its a given that we'll already be limited by available planes. Maybe that's the way to limit our impact on a given game. Rookie planes only. I do think its worthwhile for them to learn how to defend against capable, albeit handicapped players. We'll fly a tag that identifies us a coaches. I think we should refrain from any squad recruiting, making it neutral squad-wise. Offer tips, give advice, demonstrate will be the main goal. Anyone joining will have to purchase another account. I also think we should use a variation of our current name so that we are recognizable to them once they graduate and also to any other coaches. Limit coaches to 1 or 2 per game, no more than 1per side or per game.

Again let me know your thoughts. Are you interested? Is this a bad idea? Suggested guidelines?

PH

I think it's great. I suggested in my squad that maybe we have a mentor type day where we fly a second account and help the rookies. I was thinking of using a name like ROOK Whiplash so they would know who we are normally and I think if all the helpers had the same tag above them the word would catch on that these players are here to help.

I should have added that the only time I shoot them is when they want to learn to tank and I explain about not sk.
I should also mention that when I fly sometimes (the time of day) there are only a few others.
The feeling of seeing "I just got my first kill/hanger!" is rewarding.
I'm not there to recruit, just to help.

Daddy Paul Good job

well heres an update on segregation,,i was tk by conner somethin .forgot last name but some here has seen him, said it was an accident..yeeaaahh,cant fire till wheels up and wayyyy to long a burst and followed me too. So guess what..i went ol school,first time said we were even, but i told em i hate tkers..and i was goin for the ban baby!.. till reds showed..i tried to report but when i finished typing,the screen wouldnt close so i left. Will there still be tk n sk,sure,as much,who knows. But one things for sure ..separating ranks wont help, because abusers dont care.