#1I have to agree with many players
I have had great numbers in elite but still fond it really hard to pick up planes against the back drop.

If the plane is at a higher altitude than u and blue sky and clouds are behind it, then its very easy to see.

If they are lower however, they are gone. Cany see them. I find myself shooting at where i think they are center (from left to right) of the name tag just to find that im shooting at air and they are higher, lower, left or right of where im aiming.

Also if the plane is climbing or rolling the plane gets covered by the name tag.

#2is there any way to get german planes when you are the 1st player to enter a game. If i come intona zeplin game and no one else shows up, i surely dont want to be protecting the blimp against no one. I would rather shoot at it if im the only one there.

#3 there are a few issues surrounding tanks.

They have less range than in df1. And the barely move up hill at any rate. Then when going down a hill or even on flat ground its impossible to stop. The german base has trees for cover for a tank if one could actually make it to them however there are no trees for cover for a tank close enough to alliwd base. You have to come over the closest hill and run down the mountain shooting wrecklessly and praying to hit something before killed.

Can something be done about any of this?

I believe that the tank upgrade or new tank will be higher performance. I also think Zup made it this way for a reason. So people can not troll just to get in tank and start lighting up hangars from so far out. If your going to tank, your going to have to work hard and be very creative and skilled to take out hangars like before. Bullets and shells do not have the distance like before. He is forcing people to actually fly with skill and get closer to make the kill. The days of the long shooters is gone. Skilled pilots with superior flying tech will come out on top. ( I am getting whooped out there lol). I do agree that the tank should not be so sluggish up hill. The more I play elite the more I understand it is a totally different game

i think the tank needs a brake like the planes have ?

I would like to add the trees seem to be advantageous for one side but not the other. They are too close to the end of the allied airstrip on ctf making approach possible from only one direction. Also one of the bases has trees close enough to provide cover for tanks, but the other base requires tanks to be exposed when they are in range.

Airfields are known for their lack of trees at either end and are engineered that way.... even the small grassy ones. Boy, would that be helpful.

A few thoughts....

The new tank (in the hangar but still locked) is a German WW1 tank. It has the same upgrade levels available as the Renault. I'm guessing it will perform about the same.

As for tanks and their poor performance; I think it's okay that they can't tear it up too much. They are already a significant factor in both BTB and BTC. Making them more deadly would swing the games more toward the tanks than seems right in "Dogfight", no? Already it can be hilarious watching planes try to get at them. The way the forest cover is different has advantages and disadvantages for both sides. At the German base you have to make a mad dash to reach the tree cover, at the Allied base you can land in the woods and make a mad dash to get in range. I think there is a slight advantage to the Germans, but it's hard to say for sure. Who is in the tank is a much bigger factor. Lol. Once the Fokker D8 is unlocked there will be a significant advantage for the Germans unless Zup does something to counter the advantage.


As far as climbing hills, do switchbacks. You can climb faster going across the hill. In the original df tanks I could climb Duckwing mountain, not anymore, both because of the less capable tank and also because the hills got proportionately taller/steeper a couple of years ago.


An open challenge to all: climb Duckwing! I don't think it can be done.


Providing air cover for blue tanks is a major factor...and the ecforts to take out red tanks can be a desperate struggle. Bombs are getting dropped more than ever. It's been nice to see less complaining in Elite. I think more people are finding themselves in the situation where they have dropped to hit tanks but are still in the thick of a fight. If you are in-bound with bombs and you see the reds dropping on tanks are you going to complain? Are you going to keep on your bomb run or help provide cover? Is it wrong to drop to fight the red defenders? What about after the D8s are unlocked and you're on the Allied side?


So far I have seen very little abusive play and very little complaining in Elite... if only it can stay that way!


BTW : I ways feel a little guilty for taking down an undefended zep...
... but I can get over it!

regarding your post fate. I am unsure what the general consensus is, Eg. I shoot a plane down circle and manage to drop bomb and destroy it. Now in the past I have just crashed after so as not to appear that im dropping. But lately I have stuck around to take a plane or two down before auto destruct. Is it bad form to play on without bomb even though it was used to destroy enemy. Or is it acceptable strategy

Cypher7{WP*} wrote: regarding your post fate. I am unsure what the general consensus is, Eg. I shoot a plane down circle and manage to drop bomb and destroy it. Now in the past I have just crashed after so as not to appear that im dropping. But lately I have stuck around to take a plane or two down before auto destruct. Is it bad form to play on without bomb even though it was used to destroy enemy. Or is it acceptable strategy

Well, I didn't really intend to spark a debate here... it will never end. (Rhetorical or not, I guess I did ask some questions. ...) I intended to point out how tanks change the game dynamics in elite. There are some new dilemmas, or maybe just extentions of old ones. There are also many new ways to sneak... why not just put up your best fight, including paying attention and patrolling?

I'd like to see everyone embrace the different ways the games can play out. It makes for surprises and keeps the game fresh. Zup added new stuff to add complexity. Make use of the options. The worst thing that can happen is that a game can end sooner than you expect. Why limit the possibilities?

Was not trying to start a debate. I was actually asking for your advice. Rest assured Ill give you my full attention our next battle AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWwwwwwwwwwwwwwoooooooo

Cypher7{WP*} wrote: regarding your post fate. I am unsure what the general consensus is, Eg. I shoot a plane down circle and manage to drop bomb and destroy it. Now in the past I have just crashed after so as not to appear that im dropping. But lately I have stuck around to take a plane or two down before auto destruct. Is it bad form to play on without bomb even though it was used to destroy enemy. Or is it acceptable strategy

As long as your not dropping for the sole purpose of going camping, I say keep fighting after you drop.

[NLR]Jacob10000 wrote:

Cypher7{WP*} wrote: regarding your post fate. I am unsure what the general consensus is, Eg. I shoot a plane down circle and manage to drop bomb and destroy it. Now in the past I have just crashed after so as not to appear that im dropping. But lately I have stuck around to take a plane or two down before auto destruct. Is it bad form to play on without bomb even though it was used to destroy enemy. Or is it acceptable strategy

As long as your not dropping for the sole purpose of going camping, I say keep fighting after you drop.

That sums up my philosophy on the matter. Yeah, Cypher I wasn't worried about sparking a debate with you...I'm just not able to speak for a "general consensus".

I say: If you've dropped for any reason that is trying to help your team win (or just not lose) the mission, why not keep fighting? Other opinions range from always dropping to never drop except on hangars or ships. I've seen some argue that you shouldn't even drop on tanks. ( I suspect that position will fall away with the trees.)

Once someone decides that dropping is ever okay for any reason then you will come upon grey areas where someone may complain. Say for example that you takeoff from allied base and bomb a German tank that is just coming down the hill into range. If there are other reds just over the hill, is it wrong for you to go after them or are you obligated to reload before engaging? If you shoot the next oncoming red and then have to go after their tank, you may encounter the next wave of reds before you're finished with the tank. Once again, are you obligated to the reds that you must crash and reload, or are you obligated to your team to try to defend your base?

One way you are going to risk making someone mad, the other way you risk not doing everything you can to defend your base. Since this is a war game where strategy plays a big part I feel the obligation is to try to win rather than to appease someone who wants to tell others how to play.

I've decided not to worry too much about it, and just to make my decisions based on furthering my team's mission.

However, as anyone who knows me can tell you, if anyone is trying to say that something is against any rules that don't exist, I'm not going to let their false claims go unchallenged.

[NLR]Jacob10000 wrote:

Cypher7{WP*} wrote: regarding your post fate. I am unsure what the general consensus is, Eg. I shoot a plane down circle and manage to drop bomb and destroy it. Now in the past I have just crashed after so as not to appear that im dropping. But lately I have stuck around to take a plane or two down before auto destruct. Is it bad form to play on without bomb even though it was used to destroy enemy. Or is it acceptable strategy

As long as your not dropping for the sole purpose of going camping, I say keep fighting after you drop.

this is how i see it. if i drop a bomb on/at a tank with malicious intent, it's part of the battle, fair use. i get more speed, but that's not why i let fly. if i could get 2 bombs to the target, i certainly would. the 'dropper' is the pilot in a bombing mission who jettisons everything as soon as he's cleared the runway; that pilot has no intention of bombing the targets.

i know some people argue it's ok to 'drop' if you are on defense exclusively, trying to stop an incoming wave. i guess i don't agree with that. but then mine is the disadvantage if i wind up in that scenario.

ZUP, besides the tanks needing a little work, PC PLAYERS AND PLAYERS WHO USE PHONE OR TABLETS W TOGGLE/JOYSTICK OPTION NEED SENSITIVITY OPTIONS.

Its completely unfair. I use my phone i choose the joystick controll because im not very good with tilt option. Besides those of us on phones who use joystick option, pc players suffer the same fate.

When playing those who use tilt we alrdy are at a disadvantage being outturned. However the players who use tilt also have sensitivity options which make battles with them completely loosided and unfair.

Please will you add sensitivity bars for pc players and those who use joystick setting on phone and tablets to make our fates a little less embarrassing?

I sent Zup an email asking about this the other day. Haven't heard back yet, but I'm sure he has his hands full right now. I've grown accustomed to the toggle and even now with the new Tablet the tilt seems sluggish as can be in elite. In Df1 it turns great both ways.

Ok so i have found out through speaking to others that for a year now on df1 since windows 10 was released that windows users have been way superior to tilt users. But on the same hand both windows and tilt users have both been way superior to us toggle user for all 3 yrs i have played and now yet again both are still superior in elite. W toggle there is an insible box it seems and the toggle button will not go beyond none of the 4 sides. Why cant that box be made larger for more movement? Why cant toggle users have a sensitivity bar? Why is it that toggle users always get left out and its always about pc and tilt users kicking the crap out of us in turn fights? All im saying is our money spends the same as tilt and pc users. We put into this game too and should have a better rate of turning maneuverabilities too.

I'm guessing that when the big update comes to replace df1 with elite for everyone it won't be long before the servers for PC/console and the Mobile devices are segregated. When it does...

The hope is that everyone in a game will be on even footing....the fact is that there never has been and never will be completely even footing in dogfight. Zup has put many hours into trying to solve the issues with different platforms and has explained that it is pretty much impossible to get true parity. Even if the performance of devices were identical, other factors play in such as data transmission delay and god knows what else.

Someone is always going to have an advantage over someone else. What better example is there than noobs vs df veterans with fully upgraded top tier planes? I can't imagine Zup making more divisions for other device discrepancies and while I'm sure he will do his best he cannot work endless miracles. At some point we're going to get as close as possible to "fair" and then what?

At some point we're going to have to decide whether it's fair enough or if we want to move on down the road. I'm ready to see the game move beyond the point where we are being asked to limit the game to accommodate whoever has the lowest turn radius or what not. If people use different tactics they can play to their strengths. All platforms have strengths, all have weaknesses. It should not be anyone else's job to make the game easier for someone who doesn't want to find and use their own best niche.


I hope no one gets their feelings hurt over this, that's not my intent. I just want to see the game reach its potential. I see Zup trying to make it happen but unfortunately, he can't please everyone.

(As to why he hasn't adjusted the sensitivity up a notch for PC or toggle during the interim... I have no idea.)

tailzz,vip wrote: Off topic but regarding to what mcfate had mentioned about tatics,weather u drop our carry bomb. I have always carried a bomb in my 4 years of playing this game,UNTILL elite came out. Cant hit chet carrying a bomb on my phone so only other option is to drop and turn fight. Honestly I don't like it I always prided myself on being a somewhat half way good long shot. But with elite there is no way, to much skipping,jerking,and lag issues to line up and get a good shot. So I drop,I don't camp just drop. Sorry for hi jacking thread mcfate, bullet just wanted to be clear.

Not off topic now. I believe this is the thread you were referring to.

tailzz,vip wrote: Off topic but regarding to what mcfate had mentioned about tatics,weather u drop our carry bomb. I have always carried a bomb in my 4 years of playing this game,UNTILL elite came out. Cant hit chet carrying a bomb on my phone so only other option is to drop and turn fight. Honestly I don't like it I always prided myself on being a somewhat half way good long shot. But with elite there is no way, to much skipping,jerking,and lag issues to line up and get a good shot. So I drop,I don't camp just drop. Sorry for hi jacking thread mcfate, bullet just wanted to be clear.

Hi tailz,

You've been flying since I can remember. It's good to see you around Elite.

When it first came out I was playing on my galaxy phone. I hear you. I had the benefit that it was the first day so no one had the bullet drop down yet. These days you're going up against some great players who have already advanced several levels since they first got here and most of them aren't on phones.

Dropping isn't against the rules but you know how many people feel about it... they don't like it because they see it as an unfair advantage. You're doing it to handle an unfair advantage.... What's fair? Who is it fair to? Who gets the short end of the stick? Arguing over it is pointless because everyone is right from their own point of view, and no one has authority over anyone else about the matter.

So what comes next? If you are dropping and going straight into the head on guys and twisting them up every run, they're probably going to get pissed. If you aren't wanting to be disrespectful you might want to check out other ways to be useful to your team. There are many times when not shooting down a red is a better move. You can draw fire from the reds while your bomb-laden teammates pick them off. You can defend, patrol for sneaks, clean up red tanks, sneak.... you know, mix it up.

If the reds don't like it they should elect one of themselves to take you on. If they can't get by you they should keep you busy and send over sneaks. If they have someone who can take you turn fighting, you're going to end up trying to stay out of this guys way.

This kind of game is how things normally would play out of there were no chat or forum. Sure, some would not like the game but a pure fight with everything on the table....? That's the kind of game that is a true strategic battle. It's natural, like war plays out. One side finds an advantage to exploit, then the other side figures out a way to defeat it. Back and forth, as different players develop new skills. Have you ever had that one great player who seemed to get you every time until you figured out his schtick.

Lol! I know some of you catch my number... I'm always trying to mix it up. Believe me, I get very different results depending what I try against different players. There's always a few of you who's code I'm trying to crack.

Anyway, a game that plays out naturally is a constant adaptation. If you try to impose etiquette without the authority to regulate other people, you create arguments. Which do you prefer to have in the game? A war? Or an argument?


Thanks to everyone for the fun times. That's what we're here for, right?

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No Fate! We're here to fly straight down the middle of death valley into the guns of the enemy! If we shamefully survive, we are to maintain a reasonably steady, level and slow death circle so that the veteran pilots that are several levels our senior, flying their tier 7 (soon to be tier 9+) death wagons can kill us with a minimal amount of effort. To do anything else is cheatin'!!!
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