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TOPIC: computer vs handheld device

computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #235893

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So I've made a few threads like this but never noticed a feedback from Juaquin about this yet. Maybe a sore subject, or more likely one that can't be fixed (within their ability). So since this game was released on computers (quite long enough time now) the computer players can turn faster and tighter than handheld devices (tested tried n true). Is there ANY kind of equalization of the matter in the works? Or is this a subject that has been brought up numerous times but being ignored? If you can't fix this shall we ALL just play on laptop or computer with an xbox controller and kick the handhelds to the side? Or revert back to only handhelds and take away computer access to this once BEST game EVER OFFERED to the public? Don't get me wrong, this is STILL the best game ever offered to the public, but lets return some equalness so new players will continue to play and people like me who have played for 4 1/2 yrs (just about since it started) continues to pay and play for another 10yrs.




If thats the way to exterminate, it'll take too freaken looonng
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computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #235901

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zuperman wrote:

Quit Bug J4ff wrote:

zuperman wrote: about the 'equalization' of turning... it's been always equal, I've answered it dozens of times so I just stopped answering it. I play on windows 8.1 at home and on mobile device and it turns exactly the same. In fact, sometimes better on mobile. There is nothing on the code that would make one turn faster or slower.

As for the trees, which device do you use? the pink is usually because that device doesn't support a particular shader. But it should work on all windows 8.1 so i'm guessing you are using an android...


Surely you must ask yourself why has this topic been brought up so many times?Are we all wrong?420 who has played from the begining and like myself have experimented every way to get those planes to turn as effective as the game will alow us.So after 3 year there is suddenly a new way to fly that we never knew about?It seems pc users were born with this talent.I just got outturned by an SE5 when i was in a top tier plane.I couldnt blow smoke rings that small the way their plane was leaving trail behind.If they drop and get behind,you may aswell hit auto destroy.It is even evident from a distance to identify a pc user by the sheer speed compared to others.pulling G like that in a ww1 plane would tear the wings off :)



As for the trees i cant use them.PC users can hooray.
Certainly moving more in a pc direction rather than the appealing mobile game it was.



This topic always come back. Surely I ask myself why this topic is brought up so many times. I ALWAYS do when a topic is brought up several times and check it to see if I broke something. The reason for this particular case it is because it's lag related. Due to lag people seem to move faster or slower... while that's understood on moving distances, many don't connect it to also rotation. So they think they can turn faster but it's probably lag. I have to reply to this same question about 40 times by email every week. It usually not even related to windows 8, many just write to me complaining why X player can turn way faster than their plane, whether they are hacking the game, etc, etc. It's always lag. I've tested, double tested, triple tested the rotation. It's not different. Just get a windows 8.1 then an android/iPhone/whatever and put it next to each other. You, yourself, with your account and same sensitivy settings. See whether you can spot a difference using the same plane. Probably not, and certainly not something as to be considered serious. If someone can prove it wrong, do so. I'll be more than happy to fix it, but right now there is nothing to fix when I've tested this on every machine I'm able to get my hands on.

As for the graphics improvement is clearly for high end devices or pc. There is nothing I can do about that. It uses more memory and more cpu. I thought it was fair for owners of last generation devices or pc users to enjoy a little more eye candy. My nexus 7 from 2012 can't display most of it, while an iPhone 6 is able to do it pretty well. I believe a Samsung s5 should do it fine too, but I don't have one to check it. The s4 is able to get a nicer terrain but not the trees.

The idea is that as more powerful devices come in, more and more people will be able to enjoy those graphics. I have many hopes that by the end of 2015 more than half the people on here will be enjoying the new trees with faster and cheaper phones!


420 you can read zuperman statement in Updated Graphics Thread.

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Last edit: by [NLR] The Blue Fighter.

computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #235936

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Yes we all must trust the "code" over our own eyes.You can tell me black is white all day long,it's still black to me.
I see thank yous 420 so im guessing they have the same opinion.
Lag is not to blame as they would still complete one full turn in a given time.Lag creates a brief illusion of speed as the plane warps to catch up to where it should be.I'm talking about a constant speed which is visualy faster and tighter.They know it too because alot of the time they'll drop and corkscrew just to get passed.
420 when you say tested.How was this done?
Apple and android are the bread and butter for this game with pc being a small %.Don't drive us away.Alot have already left with this being a contributing factor.
I have never,not once,heard or seen an android/apple user saying they can outturn a pc user.please tell me if you can.
Don't be shy now peeps,this is not complaining or winning,just voicing an opinion of what i see and yes in my opinion it does need equalization.

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Last edit: by Quit Bug J4ff.

computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #235939

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In my opinion. This game is making a hard turn to becomjng a pc game, and mobile user will have to either get used to using pc or find a new game. Thats what many have done already. I harldy fly df any more. I stick with warthunder, where now i can even create a custom skin for my plane instead of a stock camo. Wont be long, even the strongest phone wont be able to hold df. And it will become a strickly pc game. Guess we need to start practicing on playing df on our laptops.
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computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #235942

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tKestrel wrote: In my opinion. This game is making a hard turn to becomjng a pc game, and mobile user will have to either get used to using pc or find a new game. Thats what many have done already. I harldy fly df any more. I stick with warthunder, where now i can even create a custom skin for my plane instead of a stock camo. Wont be long, even the strongest phone wont be able to hold df. And it will become a strickly pc game. Guess we need to start practicing on playing df on our laptops.


erm... wtf?

I try to make Dogfight to be able to play in ALL platforms. I'm not moving towards PC. PC is just ONE of the platforms. I will also aim to port it to xbox and playstation. And guess what? Warthunder is making a hard move into mobile too. We all aim for multiplatforms.

Lastly, your comment about "even the strongest phone won't be able to hold df" is silly. Every year phones get more powerful, in fact the iPhone 6 is more powerful than some of the laptops out there. In 1 or 2 years a new phone could easily run Dogfight with trees, grass, clouds, rain, snow, real time shadows and all the fancy stuff you add to it.

That's why I have to think about new and older devices and that's why you have a intro screen trying to adapt to your device.

But that by NO MEANS says i'm dropping mobile support.
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computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #235948

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I have to disagree with you 420. I have chased great pilots such as yourself & Wig & many others of the very best dogfighters and I can NOT turn or roll any faster than those pilots that I am chasing.. AND I don't catch up to them at all in a horizontal or vertical turning fight! (without someone making a move it would just last seemingly forever! :side: ) So if I am on my laptop versus a tablet or phone the disadvantages it suffers far outweigh the advantages. Also, accurate shooting is impossible.. ESPECIALLY at long ranges.. the arrow keys move the reticle far too much to allow you to accurately even shoot a tank at close range!!! Other disadvantages exist as well.. you can't fly straight unless you are carrying a bomb.. without one you porpoise unendingly. These are just some of the disadvantages of using a laptop versus a phone or tablet.
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computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #235949

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But heres the problem with that zup. 2 years ago, people could play df on an ipod, now if u have a phone that over 6 months old, u cant play the game unless u have all the fancy details off. In 1 to 2 years, u will have even more updates with "even better" graphics that those newer phones wont be able to handle. People will have to continually upgrade phones, or just switch to a laptop and not worry about having to constantly upgrade their device. Im not trying to but u down for the work ur doing. Its a good idea, but in my eyes, its 1 step forward, 2 steps back. Yes some can see alittle better graphics, but many others still suffer from "unfixable" lag.
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computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #235956

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See I'm on kindle fire..and yes I can not outrun a computer player..but I sure as Hell Snipe em from a distance..u use it own movement..that's why my accuracy is off d charts!! B) ;) :P
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computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #235959

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It seems PC users can change direction very fast but the tightness of the turn doesn't appear to be any different than that of a device that uses tilt/accelerometer control. Another theory could have to do with the tilt calibration set-up at the game start, I wonder if some tilt control players are actually tilting their device "too far" during a turn thereby reducing the sharpness of the turn.

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Last edit: by [*M] bware.

computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #235960

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See. Now that i can understand. I know first hand that a pc can not turn any tighter, they can however turn on a dime, which makes it seem like they turn faster. When im in a furious dogfight, idk abput everyone else, bit im throwing my phone all over the place trying to get that slight needed advantage to take the enemy down. So it stands to reason that over turning may be causing underturning.
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computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #235961

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The only possible advantage a computer player has over any other platforms is when Zebra (for instance) hits a key on his keyboard, there is no gradual application of the turn. To achieve the same result using tilt controls you would have to tilt to optimum in a fraction of a second. When a 'tilt' control is used, you tend to be more careful with your device, so the start of your turn up to full tilt is slightly slower. Also, using tilt it is harder to tell when you are at the optimum tilt point, therefore turning as tight as is possible. Using a keyboard or a joystick you don't have this problem. This is why at full throttle without a bomb, Zeb always mentions the 'porpoise' effect. The nose of the plane pitches up, so he constantly has to correct it by tapping the down key. Taking into consideration what I have already explained about keyboard controls, tapping the down key is the same as throwing the plane into a dive, then back to centre. He can't just gently press down to get the same effect as tilting down slightly using tilt controls, with keyboard it is all or nothing.
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computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #235968

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If i tilt my device a quick 90° the plane on screen still has to catch up to my input.what is beeing said here is that if a pc user hits left or right it is instant.so that is a clear advantage in a turning fight.
If a controller is used rather than keyboard then you still have this fast direction change advantage but with the added acurracy of sight control.
We haven't even mentioned how much easier to use the chute with a mouse must be.

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computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #235972

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tKestrel wrote: But heres the problem with that zup. 2 years ago, people could play df on an ipod, now if u have a phone that over 6 months old, u cant play the game unless u have all the fancy details off. In 1 to 2 years, u will have even more updates with "even better" graphics that those newer phones wont be able to handle. People will have to continually upgrade phones, or just switch to a laptop and not worry about having to constantly upgrade their device. Im not trying to but u down for the work ur doing. Its a good idea, but in my eyes, its 1 step forward, 2 steps back. Yes some can see alittle better graphics, but many others still suffer from "unfixable" lag.


I still don't get it. If your phone is 6 months old, you will be able to play the game just fine. Heck, I play with a Samsung s3 which is what? 2 years old? We test on iPhone 3gs which is what? 4 years old? it works just fine!

The game adapts to your device. You have an iPhone 6? you see trees with shadows and waves on the sea. You have an iPhone 3gs? You don't see trees, no shadows, and a flat water. Exactly the same way you've always seen it. It makes zero difference to add graphics because only the new devices will see it. The older ones will not even notice unless I come here and post pictures.

There is no step backwards. I don't see your point. You will see and run the game exactly the same way you did 2 years ago.

You get a new phone? awesome, you see better graphics. That's it. You want to play with a 2 years old device? awesome, it just keeps running the same way it was running before.
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computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #235974

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Quit Bug J4ff wrote: If i tilt my device a quick 90° the plane on screen still has to catch up to my input.what is beeing said here is that if a pc user hits left or right it is instant.so that is a clear advantage in a turning fight.
If a controller is used rather than keyboard then you still have this fast direction change advantage but with the added acurracy of sight control.
We haven't even mentioned how much easier to use the chute with a mouse must be.


why don't you try it? apps.facebook.com/1511898672358195/
that's exactly the same way windows 8 players play. You'll see it's not as easy as many people assume. I play usually better on my tablets.
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computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #235976

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I am waiting for the facebook users who previously played on android and iPhone to start saying that there must be a slight lag with the facebook connection, because they can't make a 30G turn. :P
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computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #236023

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Ok so I have noticed that one time I was in my stopwatch camel and I saw a spad (it was a DF match) he out turned me when I had no bombs and sensitivity all the way up I had no flaws no nothing wrong it was a great turn yet he still beat me it really bugged the hell out of me because I payed for the plane with real money to get the best then some spad can out turn me

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computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #236024

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Thanks for the input players, and thanks zupe for your input I really appreciate it.

The subject of tilt control and the time it takes compared to a keyboard key, mouse, or controller really hit home with me. I play on a Galaxy Note2 with tilt control and basic screen. I calibrate my tilt center every time I log on. I tilt the center slightly down, to a comfortable position and so I don't have to raise my hands up as high to turn. I never really thought about where exactly in the tilting would be the optimum without actually going too far as to actually slightly slow the turn. It is a good point.

Well like I've said before, as long as the game is around I'm playing it. I'm a HUGE fan and always promote it to others in my life that enjoys gaming. I mayyyyy start using my laptop with a gaming controller. I tried it before (using the keyboard) and I hated it. Couldn't hit squat with using the keys, and when I get a bit under pressure and rush I start hitting wrong buttons.

Thanks again zupe and everyone else that was willing to chime into this slightly worn subject.
It's been 4 1/2yrs for me here and hopefully another 40 1/2yrs lol
See you in the skies!!!




If thats the way to exterminate, it'll take too freaken looonng
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computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #236051

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I just tried playing on my pc through facebook. Let me just say I will not be throwing my phone or tablet away any time soon. I sucked horribly at head on fighting, constantly overshot in dogfighting, I havent seen my deaths outweigh my kills by that much since I seen zebra in a dogfight the last time :whistle:

In reality its probably all in what I am used to, but you wont be catching me playing on a pc anymore. Well I cant say that... You may catch me later on tonight experimenting with an xbox controller. Maybe...

secondary afterthought: If I do experiment with the keyboard again the names will be changed to protect the innocent. (dont want anyone thinking I suck that bad)
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computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #236056

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Just a question:

Can a phone or even a tablet handle ALL that visible information as fast as a PC? (or does it skip all the images it can't show?)

I play on an old iPad and am quite succesful in dogfight games, and with top players I DO see a difference between those that prefer head-on fighting above turnfights......but even more clear are those top players that like turnfights and play on a PC.

Got no problem with them being good at what they love doing better than mé, but is sometimes frustrates that they pass you, make a 180 and before you are into a turn, they hit you. BIZAR!!!

I know! It's been said over and over again.....(so, forget what I wrote and just read the bold question....)
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computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #236057

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If your device can handle all the graphics comfortably, you see all the graphics. If it can't, the optimisation skips them. The game is set to run only what your device can comfortably cope with, which is why the optimisation runs after every update.
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computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #236267

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Tried the fb version.The arrow keys are terrible but i still managed 5 kills 11 deaths in first game.A cotroller would sort that out.
At least now i know why i get shot from a chute in a split second.Using the mouse in the chute is a doddle.The little guy spins faster than MJ doing Billie Jean.This needs equalizing.its so easy to spin 180° and target where it takes about 5 seconds for android and apple to do the same.The realism of the cute action is way off.
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computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #236278

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In my almost 2years of playing this game (android and iOS )I've noticed that even on higher end devices, when you turn on all the graphics, everything is normal except when you lock on a target at long distance, your sights jump 5 pixels every time you try to gently nudge your sights on your target. So I always play with minimal graphics and everything stays smooth.
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computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #236298

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When facing strong adversity in a game and adrenaline gets flowing I get the shakes. Playing on a tablet this causes difficulty in aiming. Its like my whole plane is shaking :S .
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computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #236311

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Tip for cpu's don't just hit the up and down keys, use the side to side keys to quickly shimmy your way down to the sweet spot and BAM!! You get used to it and can take on the very best even in head on =)
The only thing i use is a laptop but like stated before i CAN turn on a dime compared to tilt players allowing me to get the quick edge and end them quickly. (otherwise a endless loop occurs) Also i do suck head on compared to others but if you master the shimmy to a fraction of the second (I'm faaar from it), its kind of like the tilt devices. I have tried tilt tablet, and phone but i am used to my pc so pretty hard.
[Another idea i picked up is to slow by one arrow push on cpu and let the plane shoot up and down while you just have to line it up strait]
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computer vs handheld device 4 years 9 months ago #236323

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I've tried several experiments, as some here can attest too.

The premise is that if two aircraft with equal speed and equal turn radii are approaching each other and pass, into a concentric circle, that any momentary gain by one aircraft would only lead that one aircraft to advance a clock position or two in the same circle. Example, plane A and B pass on a plane and imediately start to circle left. The distance between them does not change, and they circle eternally without catching each other.

I've done this hundreds of time with other players, and spun for hours at a time. The pipper will tell you if the other pilot is trying something, and if all one pilot does is chase the pipper at equal speed, the other pilot will never get enough advantage to close. If the circles become eccentric, each pilot wll glimpse the otherat times, but again, the pipper gives away any manuever.

What I have observed with windows players is that if we pass and all I do is follow the pipper, I will get my ass handed to me in less than three rotations. Take that any way you want Zup, but it's true. Same aircraft, equally equipped, an Apple tablet or Andorid phone (all I have to experiment with) won't keep up in a turn. It's not lag, as I have a 50 Meg modem dedicated to me, and most times I'm experimenting there are only one or two other planes in a DF or CTC mission, some of whom are aware of what I'm up to. The turn radius is either smaller or the plane is quicker on the same radius. Momentary advantages would only move one opponent along the clock one or two spots, in order to catch up there has to be asustained advantage.

I've gone out of my way to prove that no airiel manuever can make up the distance around the clock, against the best turnfighters obn equal terms I've spun for hours. I can't make three revolutions against a Win 8 player with an equal aircraft.

Those are facts; I developed a hypothesis from observation, conducted trials, and am positive of the outcome. What to do againsta Win 8 player? Shoot them out front. They have their own disadvantages, most will roll to even out the approach, sop learn to hit rolling targets. Break the other way from their roll if they miss and use the throttle to get them to overshoot. Never run in a flat plane, I assume the keys are eaiser left/right and up/down, whereas the tablet does angles easily, so makes loops and turns in angles to the plane of the ground and change direction continually. You will only get shots when they overshoot or pause to look at another red, either thinking it's you or simply trying to get a kill before you can get your sights on them.

Rolling past and then leaning on a mechanical advantage mindlessly following the pipper is good enough to smoke any inferior aircraft and all of the comparable ones if they try and do the same. I've talked to a lot of the Win 8 guys and it's an advantage; that doesn't mean their platform has every advantage and no shortcomings, or that they don't have to develop turning skills with the keys just to follow targets, to the contrary, but it is AN advantage, the same a s alarger fiedl of view is to identify and enage distant targtes. I know because I play on a 60 inch TV.
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