Thats why i keep game chat off, im there to help my team win not sit there and read constant comments from crying pilots, just play the match and if you dont like the style of play in that match just leave. Pilots spend money and time in this game let them play how they want. If im being camped on, spawn killed or whatever i just leave the match thats it.

Well, im good whit all. For me, if you want to win, you must make an " unfair" game. If you are a better pilot than the other team, that's an unfair game. I don't like that desesperat conception about fair game, that doesn't exist. There are pilots who don't like loss , that's all. If I see an d8 dropping , for me it's ok. A camper? It's ok !!

I must say, a red it's not death when you hit them 2 times, a red it's death when he left. That's air superiority

Ziza great comment! Very true! I dont really care how anyone plays. These dudes post pics and brag about how good they are but complain about how other pilots play, so be it. Let them play, if you dont like it leave the match and stop crying.

My beef is w those who carry 000000000000 bombs... When have there has been 1 hangars left I have dropped one so I can get to the base quicker, and then drop my other. The true definition of dropping is carry NO,ZERO BOMBS. Occasionally I will drop if ad only if I know.for.sure, and mind u it's not hard to tell, if someone else has. I use my phone ...zup has sd it my connection but I beg to differ. There are some devices that are far superior than others when u add a great connection to them, even if the insuperior device has a good connection. With that said we all kinda know who flies w o bombs and I stay away from them... Most of them aren't in squads anyway because they are kinda lame and people don't like the ethics they carry. I don't run away, but I know that there are better devices than others in a turning fight and mine is not one of them... I don't follow yellow arrows. I use what I know from some experience and looking back and to both sides to find someone. It doesn't matter though because I truly believe some devices have better reaction to this game. I bow out at that point.

McFate wrote: Harsh? Yea.
So is having others judge me as an “unfair” player when I have always made good efforts to make the game more enjoyable to all.

Hear me out and feel free to respond to any points where you think I’m off-base.

I have always had occasional complaints from other pilots calling me out for dropping my bomb even when I am still carrying. I maneuver a lot, with or without a bomb. I know this also happens to other players who fly with a similar style.

I recently left the 121st Misfits and went somewhat “incognito” so I could get a different point of view of DogFight. Once I shed the squad tag and changed my name, the complaints increased dramatically. (I’ve also seen many players seeming to act differently than they would in my previous experiences with them. Hmm….?) Some of the complainers have been pilots who I previously had respect for. (including some fellow Misfits) I want to use this opportunity to tell all that, as far as I’m concerned, complaining and whining detract more from the game than the players who use the most despicable tactics. (Team-killers not withstanding.)



Many players don’t like it when others drop their bombs in bomb-the-base or in bomb-the-carrier missions. I completely understand, although the introduction of the German d8 has me reconsidering this somewhat. Many players and squads feel there should be a game-wide rule which says:


"Always carry a bomb in bombing missions! (Only drop under extreme circumstances) "
( this is the wording of the 121st Misfits’ rule # 12)

I actually chose the wording of this rule and prepared the description of how it should be applied. Below it has been modified slightly to remove anything specific to the squad and to add a few additional thoughts)


The case can be made where sound tactics, with which a team consisting of bombers and dropper/chasers/escorts, can be very effective at destroying the target. I sincerely believe that when “squad wars” finally comes many of these issues will be re-evaluated. When teams can be arranged and sides can be chosen the game will take on a very different dynamic. Having the option for “Team Chat” would be a big development toward tactical game play. Unfortunately, the way the game currently works with all of it’s random team selection, the constantly unbalanced games and the inability to choose your match, makes it so this rule helps promote game play that is more enjoyable in general.

If you see other players, red or blue, needlessly dropping feel free to remind them that bombs are necessary to win. Aside from the fact you would be wrong, (many bombing games are won with tanks, especially bomb-the-carrier missions), its bad form does little but create bad relations between players. Don’t make a scene out of complaining. Remember that everyone has the option to play the game as they see fit and no one owes anyone a nice head to head stroll for the comfort of those who don’t like to turn fight. If you don’t like the way someone is flying you should try to show them why it is a bad idea. Some of the players you disagree with will have advanced skills but most of the “stat padding” players will soon leave to seek easier prey. If they don’t, feel free to leave the game. I suggest avoiding this as much as possible because it rewards the jerks, but then, why should you have to put up with it? If the dropper is blue you can leave (let them know why?) or choose to stay and bomb.

The recent addition of the superior German d8 is game changing issue too. I don’t see any reason why someone with the decency to play as allied should be hassled for dropping against highly ranked/skilled d8 pilots. I haven't adopted this strategy....yet. Does anyone really still argue that the d8 is not a superior plane? If you don’t think it is I encourage you not to fly it.



So, when are circumstances “extreme” enough to justify dropping bombs on anything other than a hangar or carrier? Judge for yourself how your actions will further the game objective. I’m going to outline some of what I consider to be justifications for dropping in addition to some other tactical suggestions.



1. Taking out a tank. This is the only reason that doesn’t “waste” the bomb. It’s probably best to try to shoot a tank and save your bomb incase you miss. (There are some pilots who can take you air-to-air with a bomb but it’s definitely the rare exception.)

2. To take out Sneakers. Having a red suddenly appear directly overhead or behind you from the East or West is definitely an “extreme” circumstance and an immanent threat. You need to do everything you can to take these guys out ASAP.

3. To evict a camper. If red has set up “camp” by flying bombless over your base you need every advantage you can get to take them out! When you spawn, set your brake and rev up your throttle. You can touch and drag the screen to see where they are if you think they are preparing to spawnkill you. If you time it right, you can release the brakes, pop into the air and drop before they can get you. A turning fight is always better than being a sitting duck. Try to lead them away from the base so spawning blues can have a better chance to get airborne. Also; if a red has just bombed a hangar (whether they are trying to leave or planning to camp) You may assume they are going to try to shoot you down. You are perfectly justified in dropping until they have been shot down or chased off.

4. Confronting a red dropper/chaser. There are going to be reds that drop. There is no good reason for you to be their punching bag. If they insist on playing the game that way, change your tactics. If you face an impassable red chaser you may want to take the opportunity to do some sneaks. It can be tough to coordinate with your team but it can win the game. (Team chat please, zup!) If you’re flying the German d8 you may want to consider that you already have a significant advantage over the allies and try to continue on without dropping. If the dropper is flying a German d8…? Well, there will always be those who just don’t give a rat’s ass about “fair” play.

5. Confronting a wave of reds when they are on final approach. Sometimes they all come over the last hill at the same time. Does it really make sense to not do everything you can to defend your hangars or carrier under imminent threat?

6. If you have 2 bombs but only want to carry 1, drop away! Some players don’t even consider this to be okay! I’ve had blues tell me to stop dropping because of this!

.

Once you’ve dropped and taken care of the reds you have some options. . Should you immediately land and reload just to keep your opponent from getting upset? I think there are more important things to consider. It can take a while to land and reload. It takes even longer to reload if some of your hangars have been destroyed. If you are at the blue base, no reds in sight and your teammates are already far afield, sure, why not land and reload. If reds are in sight, forget it. By the time you’re ready to get back in the air the reds could be shooting you before you get airborne. If you are in red territory and there are other blues who have bombs you can chase or “escort”. Do everything you can to protect or draw fire away from the blue bombers. You can be a very effective protector/distraction without camping directly over the enemy base. Chances are someone will complain. Just don’t hang over the red base camping or spawnkilling while there are no inbound bombers.

(and then of course):
6. When heavily outnumbered, when you’re down to 2 vs 5 or worse. If you want to puff up with pride and take it straight, good for you. Put a medal on your banner. Otherwise, feel free to drop and hang in there as best you can until help arrives. Some 2 vs 6 can be incredible! It can really get your adrenaline pumping!


This is really all a matter of etiquette. It’s a case of doing unto others as you would have done onto yourself. The problem is that people get all offended when they think someone is not being “fair”. A big problem that makes it worse is that many complainers only consider what they actually see with their own eyes. How do you know that someone didn’t have a good reason for dropping earlier in their run?

So, STFU! Give people the benefit of the doubt. Unless you know for certain that someone is being “abusive” QUIT COMPLAINING! As far as I’m concerned, if someone starts complaining about the way I play when I’m following the guidelines above they can KMA. Nothing gets me more fired up than some idiot calling out the Wambulance and trying to get other players riled up when they don’t think that I’ve got good reason for what I’m doing. Depending on my mood, if you call me out for playing dirty I may give you reason to feel that way.

To be fair, if someone simply asking if you have dropped, you should not necessarily take it as a complaint. Same is true with comments about sneakers. It is tough to accurately interpret what someone’s true attitude is when you only read their in-game chat. It’s also true that some consider it “fair” to try to mess with your head. I’ll mess back but it really is pathetic. I admit that I often have “thin skin” about such comments and I have seen many of my own comments taken as insults when they were intended only to warn my teammates. (again, zup, “Team Chat” please!)


Revenge? I also reserve the right to be vindictive against other players whose tactics I don’t appreciate. It feels much better than complaining. I don’t do this based on one incident. This is a game, why not act it out in the game? I really don’t mind if they want to try to return the favor, I like the challenge. If you see me camping/spawnkilling a particular player you can bet there is history behind the situation and yes, sometimes it’s against a chronic dropper. If it’s against you, feel free to send me a PM. Odds are I’m not mad, just returning what you’ve dished out to others.

duh huh huh wat? Sorry fell asleep. Think I'll wait for the movie to come out!

G.I. Mac wrote: This thread makes me miss Pedrinho.

think Pedrinho is the only happy Brazilian today.!

MR McFate.....

I totally agree with what I'm understanding you to be saying here. Just wanted you to know that my friend.

Its become a real drag listening seeing the trash talk in game and on forum regarding this issue. An issue that Juaquin him self has endorsed as a way of fair play. Poeple getting chewed out, people chewing others out on account of different tactics is total BS and is over stated in damn near every instance. Play the game you want to play, your game. What ever that might be. To my knowledge, only Swan killing with a tank team killing and bombing ones own hangers are offences that can get you banned.

For myself, not that it matters, I try and keep my bomb with me until I'm over my drop target. Does this happen every time? Hell no it doesn't, and it can't be predicted and that's one of the many facets of this game I enjoy. You never know how this latest run will end (true there are the most likely to hàppen ends, which is me watching my smoking plane fall bounce and burn right before I get shot in chute). If I need to drop to defend against, well anything, I will and do it freely! And could give a poop about what anyone thinks or says! Its my game, I'm going to play it my way, just like everyone else......

The players and there really isn't that many of them, that drop at the end of runway to take advantage of the bombers to scared to drop for fear of what there squad mate may say, and are doing it to take full advantage of there quicker speed do to dropping. The ones that are just looking o getting easy pionts, well yes they suck, and I would really like to see them in a dogfight mission then bombing one, thing is it isn't for me to say how they should be playing.

I have been on the side that you should never drop!!! Die in with honor!!! Well I just died a lot. NoI naturet to mention dogfighting while carring a heavy bomb is as exiting as watching paint dry. Also there is know stat for dying honorably carrying your bomb.

Its a game that let's you as individual play your own kind of game, your own way. So just because you encounter a plane that has dropped doesn't mean they have the lag switch next in there arsenal of tricks. Drop your bomb and fight. Or keep you bomb and fight. Either way have fun!!!


Fate, yo are tip of the sword dogfighter, anyone who has met you in the air as red knows this.... Your the best dogfight pilot I've ever seen with a bomb. Just wanted to tell you that too.

Like the post!

When I first started this game it was lopsided so I switched from my d8 before getting one kill.. When I switched it was 6 vs 3 of us... A wave of d8$ and this was the end result. Most bugged out because I guess they didn't like it but I flew a Sopwith... My point is that the Sopwith isn't the inferior plane, the d8 is tough to hit unless u know where to aim. And no I DID NOT DROP ONE TIME.

I.wish I took a screen shot to.validate that the beginning roster was much more lopsided in favor of the reds... U all know how.it is when some start getting spanked they drop out. Subhuman was there, zule, virus demon, and lose an clear... Sure they can validate if need be... My point is there isn't a need to drop when u r outnumbered

I will make a few points

1 I drop one bomb especially when flying allied

2 I hope I'm not much of a complainer. I usually just try to have fun and play.

3 I will drop now when someone gets behind me, why be a sitting duck when someone gets behind you.

4 what I hate are hypocrites, those who complain about all this and then I will spawn into a game and see the same players doing it.
I could name several well known hypocrites who cry foul and then you will catch them doing it the next day.

5 I do not sneak however I never thought it was bad. When I first started playing I can remember it was a very common thing to see someone going high, it was normal back then.

6 there are a few players I just cannot stand. LOWENHEART, BUBI, KEN and a few others. They will camp and spawn kill without mercy and go for the cheap easy kills. I have absolutely no respect for them. There is a big difference between tactics is which you are apart of verses the cheap dirty playing.

7 if a spawn into a game and see these players then I have the chioce to just leave and not be a part of that game. NOW PAY ATTENTION TO THIS FOLKS. Let me tell where I get mad, if I'm in a long and good game having fun and one of the above players spawn into the game and ruins it then I'm not happy.

8 if you spawn into a game and don't like the players than just leave, if you are one of the above players don't spawn into a game already in progress for a long time and ruin it, SIMPLY START AT A NEW GAME FROM THE BEGINNING.

9 I hope that makes sense to you all.

This is what I was essentially trying to show ya.. stupid photo bucket on the other hand was not... Lol

McFate... Like I said and I don't want anyone to think I'm trash talking ya because I've always liked and gotten along with ya... I just don't agree with like two points.. One being outnumbered...
Are u never coming back to MISFITS!?

Love ya Davey!!!!

BULLET [M]isfit wrote: Love ya Davey!!!!

Love you to BULLET

As lucid, eloquent and dead-on (not to be confused with "head-on") a post as I've ever seen on this forum. It should be required reading, along with SB467's Dogfighting Dicta, before anyone is allowed to enter a live multi-player game.

Mr. McFate, thank you for articulating so well what many of us who endure "dropper" complaints have tried and clearly failed to convey. My enthusiastic support and unbridled admiration, sir. After having said which I will happily STFU.

--w--

Hmm well I kinda like The T.A.S.K Force, let me tell u why. For one its a way for players to all be apart of something other than their squads. Two, it give us something to do, other than the same ol same ol. Im just waiting to see how this is gonna turn out tbh lol

Hmmmm.....sounds good there are as bullet says some things that are valid but I think hes right if ur facing a d8 there is no need to get panicy I think there actually easy for me u just act like I'm turn fighting and ahem close enough I kill em hats all.
Now the real issue is not that bombs are being dropped its more along the lines of why are they dropping or why did they dropped?.
If u can get to the bottom of it then yes I agree to what ur saying but if they are dropping just Cu's they can do it then. Well. . . Gye choice is really Ur's then.
U can iether tell them to stop and or just leave. If hey are a known dropped and are getting famuse with it should u look into that matter! . . .YES intact if it continues shouldn't u tell someone other then common fighter pilots? Maybe.
Well I could raddle kn but I think iv said enough bout it for now anyways. But if all considered then yes I agree with what ur saying.
and yes I dropped I outnumbered situations too if that helps u some.

Thanks to all who have posted and especially to those who sent PM s.

My hope is to get people to think about others more and to relax a bit and to really let the game be a game!

It's almost a "religious" divide how different people seem to feel about the issue. To me it comes down to players freedom to enjoy the game without having additional restrictive rules. (I guess I'm a dogfight libertarian? ) If a rule can't be "coded into the game " it makes controversy and unnecessary squabbling.

I understand that there are those who would like the game to have a variation where there is a mission which is only head to head bombing runs. Unfortunately this only seems possible with unenforceable rules. Any rules that try to enforce this would create a greater need for blacklisting, moderating, reporting....who really thinks that would make the game better?

Any of you who like the head on only battles; would it be a problem if there was "team chat" and you were able to coordinate escorts and bombers? Or do you just want everyone to go head on into the valley of death?

There is no historical precidence for the head-to-head-only battles. There is very little strategy in it. It makes very little use of the games potential. Do you really feel that it is reasonable to ask that all bombing games be limited to this? The case has been made by others that there are only two bombing missions and those should be left to the people who like head on fights. Really? Shouldn't there be a mission with bombs which is more in line with how the real battles were fought?

If new maps were an option maybe there could be a "canyon" variation with a powerful jet stream above the canyon walls so everyone would need to stay on course and head to head. Or maybe a variation where you could only drop on a target. (Yuck )

Unless a new variation comes the head-on players are asking for restrictions which are voluntary or manually enforced. It really is not feasible. Think about it. How do you communicate this to every player? Not everyone is on the forum and even if they were there is no consensus. The only way this can be enforced is by shaming, berating, threats, vindication...what kind of "community" does that promote?

STFU!

(Okay, "STFU" is rude. I'll tone it down, but don't have any patience for those who call me a cheater when I feel fully justified for the way I play. If you want to give me "what for" in game go ahead. Just don't make me try to swallow any BS.)

right O mac fate glad u brought up
and as i take it . . . MAY THE BEST MAN WIN!!!!!!

BULLET [M]isfit wrote: When I first started this game it was lopsided so I switched from my d8 before getting one kill.. When I switched it was 6 vs 3 of us... A wave of d8$ and this was the end result. Most bugged out because I guess they didn't like it but I flew a Sopwith... My point is that the Sopwith isn't the inferior plane, the d8 is tough to hit unless u know where to aim. And no I DID NOT DROP ONE TIME.

But you are an amazing shooter Bullet!! What happen whit that pilots who aren't ? Like me
That's why I'm make turnings fight whit or whitout the bomb

I believe that all must do what he knows to do very well, if I'm a turning fighter , I'm gonna do that. But, on the other side, I think whip ( in some coment he make ) has rigth, that pilots who only fight in one style , they lost skills or they are missing the opportunity of learn new skills. Then? I think everbody can do whatever he wants , for me it's ok. An fair game doesn't exist

I find that the people quickest to cry foul at a bomb-dropper are those least interested in imaginative game-play. Some of us come at a game like Dogfight from a perspective founded on action/adventure games, real time strategy games, games in which success is dependent on puzzle solving and outside-the-box thinking and, gawd forbid, historicity. Others have their experience rooted in repetition, the mastery of an isolated skill. A God of War player will almost certainly find limited entertainment value in Bubble Town or Centipede or Doom...a Halo player isn't likely to have the patience for Civilization or Prince of Persia or Grand Theft Auto.

The central question then becomes; is Dogfight an arcade style shooter or an historically accurate flight combat sim? Are you pretending to be Master Chief? Or Ernst Udet? Pac Man? Or Albert Ball? Are you fantasizing about encountering Richtofen over the front? Or just vegging out with some comfortably mindless, repetitive pixel busting?

The irony I never see mentioned is the fact that anti-droppers decry bomb dumping as the private domain of kill hoarding players who care about nothing but racking up personal stats...but the highest single mission kill scores I'm aware of are never recorded by droppers, they're arguably only possible by retaining the bomb(s) and slogging across the map over and over in endless head-ons. It's actually the slavish bomb-carriers who are less concerned with the mission outcome and more focused on bagging eight kills, falling, re-spawning, bagging eight kills, falling...and on and on until they have their 100+. Or their 300+. My own highest scores have all been logged while carrying, bomb toting has produced my greatest personal statistical benefit, while in the missions in which I've elected to drop (and have had to endure incessant tiresome kvetching about it) I've been the most effective in service to my team.

I get the appeal of occasionally lumbering back and forth countless times and rolling up massive amounts of kills. I wish the complainer contingent would learn to see the appeal in the obverse approach and not only view it as an interruption to their one-trick fun.

I agree Mc.
I personally don't talk much "About" the game,
Mostly just chat.

This game I hate to repeat is .......

WAR

What can't some people understand about that!

I play a mutiplayer tank game,and when it comes to playing cleen,
Makes this game feel like a formal "tea and biscuits".

Now I never hear anything even close to the whining i hear in this game.

This game is war.
If you can't stand that,
Go play candy crush, or flappy bird.

You can play nice and such, but this ain't no
Tea party.

Pull up your big girl pants and fight!

Let pilots play the way they want to play. We all spend time and a lot of us have spent money on this game. I myself dont like to drop, but will under certain situations. I find carrying my bomb makes me a better shot it balances my plane a little better.

Unreal.. this guy must not really know how good a pilot you are...

McFate wrote: It went back and forth a bit until he said "You won't like it if I drop"

I can't believe he said that.. he's lucky you didn't just drop and wipe up the killing floor with the shredded remains of his aircraft...

ZebraUp wrote: Unreal.. this guy must not really know how good a pilot you are...

McFate wrote: It went back and forth a bit until he said "You won't like it if I drop"

I can't believe he said that.. he's lucky you didn't just drop and wipe up the killing floor with the shredded remains of his aircraft...

Aw, thanks for your support, Zeb!

I drop all the time
should there be a problem
no
to the first mane who has never sinned and can prove it, can accuse and stone, the sinner -jesus
I have dropped
but I dont camp
ever
there for I have the right to complain
if you've never dropped then complain

Matthewstuart1 wrote: I drop all the time
should there be a problem
no
to the first mane who has never sinned and can prove it, can accuse and stone, the sinner -jesus
I have dropped
but I dont camp
ever
there for I have the right to complain
if you've never dropped then complain

He drops and camps and spawn-kills and lies about it! One of your neighborhood T.A.S.K. sentinels at work.

... and then he puts the lotion in the basket.

PS I don't think he is part of the TASKuderos.

Wigbomb wrote:

Matthewstuart1 wrote: I drop all the time
should there be a problem
no
to the first mane who has never sinned and can prove it, can accuse and stone, the sinner -jesus
I have dropped
but I dont camp
ever
there for I have the right to complain
if you've never dropped then complain

He drops and camps and spawn-kills and lies about it! One of your neighborhood T.A.S.K. sentinels at work.

I never said that I never sinned
you cant blame
you have sinned
you dropped to take me out
you even camp to take me out
you sir have sinned so drop your stone

Wigbomb wrote:

Matthewstuart1 wrote: I drop all the time
should there be a problem
no
to the first mane who has never sinned and can prove it, can accuse and stone, the sinner -jesus
I have dropped
but I dont camp
ever
there for I have the right to complain
if you've never dropped then complain

He drops and camps and spawn-kills and lies about it! One of your neighborhood T.A.S.K. sentinels at work.

I never spawn killed

Matthewstuart1 wrote:

Wigbomb wrote:

Matthewstuart1 wrote: I drop all the time
should there be a problem
no
to the first mane who has never sinned and can prove it, can accuse and stone, the sinner -jesus
I have dropped
but I dont camp
ever
there for I have the right to complain
if you've never dropped then complain

He drops and camps and spawn-kills and lies about it! One of your neighborhood T.A.S.K. sentinels at work.

I never spawn killed

you gota prove that you have never spawn killed to
me personalty
to even accuse any one of that
and im no longer a task sentinel
due to the likes of you
you've earned my hatred
you dont play with fire kid