I've been thinking... Would DF have room for a dedicated bomber that can fight/dance with single-seat types? Both sides seem to have their own representatives for the role:

Bristol F2B (Allies)



The most famous and most successful (methinks) of the WWI multi-roles. Its reputation speaks for itself, being able to do bombing, reconnaissance and give opposing fighters a run for their money. Also known as the "Brisfit" or "Biff"


Albatross C.XII (German)



I'm not sure which of the German two-seaters is a good match to the Brisfit but considering it's Albatross heritage, this two-seater might fit the bill.


To fulfill the role of a rear-gunner, game could have an AI with an accuracy of... let's say 40%? Any thoughts? I personally wouldn't mind flying the Brisfit into combat during BTB and BTC games.

Photos borrowed from The Aerodrome website

The Junkers J.1 was an interesting one. The first purpose designed ground attack aircraft, first with armour for the pilots and guns fixed downwards to fire at troops on the ground. of the 200 odd built form 1917 only one was lost to enemy fire.

[e]hammer_tool wrote: The Junkers J.1 was an interesting one. The first purpose designed ground attack aircraft, first with armour for the pilots and guns fixed downwards to fire at troops on the ground. of the 200 odd built form 1917 only one was lost to enemy fire.

That's a very impressive track record, considering that there were only 200 built.

You think that these two planes would do as bombers should Zup add them to the game?

[TFL] Robert33 wrote:

[e]hammer_tool wrote: The Junkers J.1 was an interesting one. The first purpose designed ground attack aircraft, first with armour for the pilots and guns fixed downwards to fire at troops on the ground. of the 200 odd built form 1917 only one was lost to enemy fire.

That's a very impressive track record, considering that there were only 200 built.

You think that these two planes would do as bombers should Zup add them to the game?

That seems a good idea. We could even provide a fighter escort onto the target..
Would suggest that you need more than two hits to bring it down though. Maybe five like a tank.
Also their handling characteristics would need to be correspondingly sluggish.

[TFL] muziki1 wrote:

[TFL] Robert33 wrote:

[e]hammer_tool wrote: The Junkers J.1 was an interesting one. The first purpose designed ground attack aircraft, first with armour for the pilots and guns fixed downwards to fire at troops on the ground. of the 200 odd built form 1917 only one was lost to enemy fire.

That's a very impressive track record, considering that there were only 200 built.

You think that these two planes would do as bombers should Zup add them to the game?

That seems a good idea. We could even provide a fighter escort onto the target..
Would suggest that you need more than two hits to bring it down though. Maybe five like a tank.
Also their handling characteristics would need to be correspondingly sluggish.

Truth be told bro, the two-seaters mentioned, particularly the Brisfit (Bristol F2B), can actually hold its own against enemy single-seat types. In fact, the Brisfit does even better when treated as a fighter with a sting on its tail

I reckon this would make the game a bit more intersting. Pilots new to the big boy server won't feel so helpless anymore since they have a plane that allows them to bomb targets, maneuver like crazy when they have to, and also have protection of sorts from the more experienced and ddicated single-seaters courtesy of the AI rear gunner. Of course, if you stick an experten into one of these planes, its a different story altogether.

Methinks the would-be performance of these two-seaters can be similar to lets say the tier one planes. Their hit points should be just like any other plane in the game as it wouldn't be fair to go after a fairly agile two-seater that has an AI rear gunner shooting back at you taking three more hits to bring down while the sting on the tail can take you down in two to three hits.

Assuming Zuperman considers this possibility that is.

It would be real fun bro, is to actually have two players in the bomber. One pilot and one rear gunner. Maybe with its own mission.
It may work if say, you log into the mission, first one there has choice of seat, ie pilot or.gunner. Then wait in the hanger for another blue to come along who fills the second seat. Kills, deaths are equal between the two. Would suggest mobile sites for the rear gunner. Which pilots would you trust though..

[TFL] muziki1 wrote: It would be real fun bro, is to actually have two players in the bomber. One pilot and one rear gunner. Maybe with its own mission.
It may work if say, you log into the mission, first one there has choice of seat, ie pilot or.gunner. Then wait in the hanger for another blue to come along who fills the second seat. Kills, deaths are equal between the two. Would suggest mobile sites for the rear gunner. Which pilots would you trust though..

I'm not sure about the option to play as the rear-gunner. I imagine that there aren't that many pilots/players out there willing to play the role of sting-in-the-tail.

Well, yes see what you mean, although there are plenty of good marksmen here already that might love to do the "sting in the tail"
Good comms between pilot and gunner would be needed though.o

Oh my back seat gunner. - can do.that. but the btc mission needs gunners to. Ship.defensive that works le.be so cool and you'd have to rank.up as gunner or pilot. More levels to.make more than 31 when your 31 you should be able to chose you want ok.maybe lvl.25 bit a respective rank
So.morafs have the goal. And you should only be able to do that after you've flown for more than a year in the game

Yes. Moraf only mission. That would keep them occupied..

The role of bomber pilot and rear gunner should be left to upper ranks. This will take special team effort. But of should be an added mission to the ones.we have now since it will.be fighters and bombers together this would bring a new aspect for all

Hmm... Now that you've mentioned it Darrax, your idea would really make for a great variety of scenarios. Hope Zuperman would consider our ideas

How about a mission where one side's objective is to flyover the base and take a photo and their opposition is a bunch of single-seaters? High-ranking players/pilots would be automatically placed in the side of the two-seaters while lower level-types would automatically be placed on the single-seater side. The match ends when the two-seater that took the photo manages to return to its base or when the entire two-seater squad gets wiped out by the single seaters. Of course, the two-seaters for the job would either be the Brisfit or the Junkers J.1/Albatross XII.

I've been working on this for months already. It's not as simple as it looks. The main problem is lag and two seats. You see, since there is lag and one pilot would be 'driving', the pilot bombing/on gun may be shooing or aiming at a very different location where the plane is in reality. This is annoying when you fly against an opponent, but it is impossible if you have one gunner depending on the position of another player.

So... so far i haven't been happy with the result but trust me I'm trying my best to get something like this ready.

Thank.you zup

See what you mean. That would be a problem. Thanks up...

zuperman wrote: I've been working on this for months already. It's not as simple as it looks. The main problem is lag and two seats. You see, since there is lag and one pilot would be 'driving', the pilot bombing/on gun may be shooing or aiming at a very different location where the plane is in reality. This is annoying when you fly against an opponent, but it is impossible if you have one gunner depending on the position of another player.

So... so far i haven't been happy with the result but trust me I'm trying my best to get something like this ready.

Thank you Zup hmm... Would an AI rear gunner would be a simple solution considering the technical difficulties that you mentioned?

I mean there's already an AI for enemy aircraft during training missions... So why not tweak it a bit to make it a gunner?...