Hey zup. I've read here on forum about u won't remove the noob shields on count of a few vets taking advantage and sk the crap out of them. That's fine. I agree they shouldn't be sk and be helped to learn to play the game.  But since u won't remove it, how about reducing it to maybe like 10 hits? Instead of 16-20. That's just too much qnd I think most vets wud agree. We have to chase them half way across the map for 20 hits.. and half of them aren't even noobs. And if say someone like mean or Vanessa is paired with a noob in a match u can forget standing much of a chance due to the 20 hits it takes on a noob. I understand u say that u don't want to lose new players cuz they continuously get shot down.. what about us vets? Don't we count? Can we compromise on the noob shields and maybe cut it in half? I know u work to bring us a game we can all enjoy.. but I tell ya the way it is I roll my eyes when I pop in game and see noob accounts.. especially when some are 2nd accounts with a hell of an aim on them. It gets aggravating for the vets that aren't hiding behind noob shields. So how about a compromise?  So we can all go back to enjoying the game? Thanks for reading.

i agree pink i was playing a higher rank and two noobs i dont mind being outnumbered any time i can hold my own but now i just leave the games and im playing less and less as time goes by

Well said Pink. I welcome a compromise of 10 hits. I recall just a couple of players killing noobs for pts and making the shield an option, but many more would not do so and offered tips for them to improve. Games have been pretty full and enjoyable. 

I second (third?)(fourth?) the change to 10 hits for noobs. I have had them brag that they can't be shot down.

I would also like to see manning guns on enemy's ship blocked.

just drop a bomb on there plane

I really like the noob protection. It's true, there are some who are very good, but that doesn't always mean guys who have a second account but are just good because they may have played another video game beforehand.
We must not forget that today's children are born with a tablet or a mobile phone in their hand.
For me, you get to favor a No. 1, 2, 3 so much that they can't even be shot.
I'm not saying I've never shot a nr2, but that's unintentional, my name letters are so small that I can hardly read the names. I always let them pass.
I personally don't feel good about knocking down a No. 1, 2 or 3 and yes, there are people who actually hunt for it.
Are we really so narrow-minded that we don't give a nr 1, 2 or 3 anything? Do let them fly around, they usually shoot for miles next to your plane.
Above a rank 3 I suggest reducing the shield but then also not giving any points or counting towards kills to those who shoot them eg until rank 10 and reward the noobs with more points.
If they get more points they will also rank faster and lose the advantage. Then the worse players will be protected longer and the better players will soon be level with the others. It will also stop the noob killers from collecting points.
But please, keep protecting a number 1, 2 and 3 with immortality if necessary.
They are the future of this game!!!

Good point about the levels 1 2 and 3. That's fine. Protect them till they're level 5 if needed. Also agree that some are genuinely just good. I usudo let them do whatever they're doing unless they shoot at me. But even then 4 shots I'm dead.. takes 20 to kill them. That's just too much. 

In 2013 I was a noob in a Airco being massacred by 7 veterans and even so I don't stopped the game. I practiced and improved my skills .  wrote:
 

Most of the players who have been around a while never had a noob shield and we are still here now , I understand the need for a shield but only up to rank 5 and for 10 shots not 20.

And this, if someone (as quoted above as an example) like VHuntress (She DON'T DO THAT, I'll just say before she kills me again ) with a second account you could say yes that no one has the chance to fly around anymore because then you will be down faster than you have taken off. But also know that this is only for 1 or 2 days and that this person will no longer be a noob very quickly. That is why it is interesting to increase the points of noobs to ranking 10 so that the very good ones are no longer noob soon.
Yes Vanessa, I know, we've all been noob and shot till we got blue hands banging on the table. But how many started with you and how many are left??? They're not all hard aunts like you. The idea is to get more players and they will never come as long as people start chasing a number 1, 2 or three. Out of 100 who start, 98 will soon give up. If we give them a chance to learn to fly their plane first, maybe 20 or 30 will be left.
 

It could be till level 5 with about 10 hits not 20/30 hits is exaggerated and the crashes between planes in the mid air happens much more since the implementation of these shields. Frits you and Dusty arrived at this game, practiced and got skills . I meaning people will always stop the game for any excuse, for example as many stopped, because of bullet drop.

Okay it's everyone's worst nightmares turn at the keys...

... I began playing about nine weeks ago. When I began there wasn't a noob shield. Three bullets could take me down, but I persevered and now when I'm in a Pfalz i can be an absolute nuisance to the ww2 plane pilots. To the extent I know full well if two groups go head to head, the high level players will priotitise me as a danger. The like of Deez, Owl,.Pegoud and Huntress will happily tell you I'm a bit of a pest in mid air. I can shoot most of them down given the range and breathing space to do so. 

But recently that's not been possible without some level three blasting me out of midair with three bullets, or simply crashing into me after eating up to 23 hits. I know after my fourth hole in the windshield im on fire and i need to watch it. Some of the newer ones know that after 11 holes they got nine left and just start aiming their plane at us. Also, the level.1+2 nubs flying like pros and pulling all kinds of shenanigans are, i suspect, alt accounts of the ones who were victimising noobs before. I suspect this because they're advising them what to do during certain games or trying to organise situations that will annoy and irritate others. 

If I have one suggestion its that i agree with the ten hit thing. Till level five... After that they get a warning that the shield is off. Also that tanks in carrier destroy/sub mission reappear at the base, not where they crashed. It's being abused and only by certain players, we know every time we down them (it's entirely one sided, they've forgotten how to fly) they're going to crash into the woods and hide there in a tank. It's every game they're in now. None of this is assisting sporting conduct. You know how I insist my members fly and conduct themselves and temperamental as I may be, Im above using cheap tricks to get a victory. 

Im with the bigs as a level eleven i say turn the shield down a few notches. It'll make em more cautious is all.

Yep, I agree with you. I said from the beginning that it was a work in progress. Few new players were joining the game and staying because they were getting annihilated by the vets. There were many complaints when I added the shield, but you can see a huge change in new people. Rooms are getting full more often than not now, and the biggest impact has been the noob shield. It has the benefit not only of new people joining in, but also more people leveling up and moving into squads and so on. It seems that change although it was painful, it has improved the game a lot.

But again, I set it to 30 hits at the beginning, then I lowered it to 20. And I'll check the stats and see where it should stand now. Keep in mind that the idea was that if we manage to get enough players constantly, you will never see a noob and the shield won't be required. That was my plan the whole time. The shield was a temporary fix because no new players were coming in due to some vets destroying them.

Btw, I saw some replies from people who are rank 12 complaining about the noob shield... I hope those realize they haven't seen a noob shield. The shield is only activated when the difference between your rank and the other player is way over 15. Meaning, that if you are rank 12... no noob has a shield of 20 hits because your rank is not high enough. The shield gets activated when you are rank 30 and you are shooting at a rank 2 for instance. Previously, those guys were destroyed and left the game in 30 seconds to never come back. And the shield goes down little by little as the rank difference is lower. If you are rank 5 against a rank 3, there is no shield at all. Or rank 25 vs a rank 20. No shield. The shield begins increasing little by little when there are more than 10-15 rank differences between you and the other player. If you need 20 hits to bring someone down, it is because that person has a rank way lower than yours which means that person has an airplane that is way worse than yours too. And once they reach a certain rank, there is no shield no matter the difference. 


 

zuperman wrote:

Yep, I agree with you. I said from the beginning that it was a work in progress. Few new players were joining the game and staying because they were getting annihilated by the vets. There were many complaints when I added the shield, but you can see a huge change in new people. Rooms are getting full more often than not now, and the biggest impact has been the noob shield. It has the benefit not only of new people joining in, but also more people leveling up and moving into squads and so on. It seems that change although it was painful, it has improved the game a lot.

its not all VETs zup there are just a few bad apples in the barrel would it be possible to adjust the hits with the amount of players in the game as well ie i was in the game with two noobs and one vet against me thats a 3x1 ratio i was impossible to play the noob would wound me then the vet would kill me with one shot i started avoiding the noobs or bombing the plane after all they only tend to carry one bomb so its not a big loss but just becomes hard work and not relaxing i play to unwind not to get wound up.when i startedi was relentlessly spawnkilled by wig and bubi  and many more seasoned players .as mean said one time if you cant take it go play candy crush

But again, I set it to 30 hits at the beginning, then I lowered it to 20. And I'll check the stats and see where it should stand now. Keep in mind that the idea was that if we manage to get enough players constantly, you will never see a noob and the shield won't be required. That was my plan the whole time. The shield was a temporary fix because no new players were coming in due to the vets destroying them.

 

Hummmmm…. really the noobs??? Come on guys the noobs?  Most of you are high ranking players with years of experience and superior planes that any of those noobs. Ah yes that some might be abusing the system to gain some strange upper hand against any other players…. well, that to me is due to the points war but that is just my opinion; still those vets starting over or abusing the system are still in a disadvantage in the type of plane they are using against us, and those cases should just a few players.  Not playing a lot but have gone against a few of these noobs and I just shoot them, help them, or let them shoot me. I do not care about whatever KDR means, or points gain or lost; to me the importance is to attract and keep more players to the game of DF Elite. A few months players were posting that we do not have players in game, I am alone in rooms, no one playing….and since this shield thing was implemented, I have seen an increase of players in game. So, we want them to play without any advantage or less protection against top players? For what so that they all leave? The main point is to get them to stay, and this shield thing is working, I think we should adapt as we always do and look for ways to play on. Let them play, teach them, help them, be more welcoming. WE NEED NEW PLAYERS FOR THE GAME, if the way to do that is for a noob to shoot me down or for me to lose a game here and there because the noob manages to survive because of his shield; so be it! I’ll take it. In my eyes the formula or experiment work, so be patient zuperman give those noobs a fighting chance, the GAME NEEDS THEM. If it’s working, I think we all should give it more time to grow the community of players. Best to play with challenging noobs than to play against an empty room. Though saying playing with yourself might sound a bit weird. LOL
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. ENJOY THE GAMES AND HAVE FUN WITH IT!

Im not responsible if the game have developed in that way i get to play with lowranked players. 
I become to like the game just because the simplicity. One team play the other team...when the mission is completed you win or lost... If losing ,just to move to next mission and try to improve your skills so you can be victorious with your temporary teammates.
Next time you might play in same team with players you killed earlier, you just give all you have to help your team to a victory, thats never been a problem for me... Im not killing reds because i hate them, i kill them because that's the core of the game intention.

Just kill the reds, kill all of them , no mercy
I hope everyone realize that's the way it was intended to be from the very first beginning...
Enjoy the game as it was  intended to be from the very first beginning and don't get feeling of guilt if killing reds even if they are untrained noobs.






 

Nowadays is a crime if you kill reds lol Ive seen me and other veterans are being out turned in a top tier plane by noobs in a Spad.

Exactly! I'm not saying remove the shield.. not all.. just compromise and lower it. Like I said if in a game where it's 2 or 3 on 1.. with the noob being on the team with more players it's an advantage. I do not and will intentionally aim at a noob first unless they shoot at me. But when they do while I'm shooting them the vet player or players on team with them shoot u down. No I don't care a bout kdr, wins, losses, or hangers.. cud absolutely care less. And this thread wasn't meant to turn into argument among players it was meant to get zups attention stating that 20 hits is too much that's all.. not saying remove the shield just asking for it to be lowered is all. 

I understand that the issue at hand is not to take away the shield, that is to make it less and I believe zuperman is looking into it, like someone posted  early, he is the creator of the game and makes the determinations he thinks are necessary to keep the game going so that everyone can enjoy it. We are failing to understand that the game is a business and as such he is the one that should make the changes, he thinks that will keep the game going. He is open to suggestions, and I have seen he does listen to his customers and tries to maintain fair balances. But what is confusing to me is that before the shields were implemented people were postings about empty games, also posting that the WW2 server had no players, that noobs should be allowed to play with the big boys…and now that the wishes were granted, we are saying that the noobs are too tough for us. (In the WW2 server where their planes are inferior, and you are unable to outturns or come up with better and creative ways to shoot those red noobs?) So, are we saying we want them all back in the WW1 server? Or they should go back to a separated server until they get the hang of the dynamics of the plane. I have encountered noobs that do not know how to fly the plane straight and even less how to aim.  So as a top player I should take advantage of his weakness and go after him over and over without trying to help him? The result will be they will leave the game, we all seen that.  The point of the shield is to keep new players from leaving the game so that we do not get left shooting at white clouds in the sky. If there are no reds to shoot at…, what will you shoot? When most of us started we did it the hard way, no shield and got kill over and over that is true, but back them the game had plenty of players and people were kind enough to help out those of us who were starting; now a days we all seen there is just a few new players and if we go back to going for the points for noob fishing  in a relentless way….well we all  have seen the outcome of that movie before. .   I see some players do believe it should be open season in red noobs not caring if the game of Dogfight Elite loses players and true true…the game is to shoot reds no one is saying they should be off limit; but I also seen other games where noobs do get some fighting advantages from the creators of the game.
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. I am confident that zuperman will find a balance that will not hurt the experience of the new players so that more and more stay in the game and help us old players to have a better experience as well with full games.

Helloooo Pink
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Oh, noooo no argument at all I believe its good input for zuperman to read all comments and opinions about the game. It’s a very engaging thread and it’s obvious that is a real concern amongst all of us that love this game. So, if it helps to bring a better gaming experience and help keep the game alive it’s all gooooooooooooood!

As I said, I agree that I may have to lower the shield. But I see a misconception:

Misconception: When those players lose the shield, they will have a big surprise... not true. Players do not suddenly lose the shield. The shield is between you and a particular player. This means, that if you are rank 48 and that player is rank 4, he will have a shield against you. He has absolutely zero shields against a player who is ranked 10 for instance. And as he moves up in ranks, he loses the shield little by little. In short, there is no such thing as "I had a shield, I don't have it anymore". It just doesn't work that way.

Also, the video you posted about a player turning 90 degrees against you, has nothing to do with the shield. That player has lagged, he has been turning probably for a few seconds and when the data catches up you see it moving and turning fast. That has always been the case since day one. They experience the same thing with you. They probably see you lagging and moving and rotating super fast. Remember, lag works both ways. It's just the connection speed between two points. If they see you lagging, that means you see them lagging too. Removing or adding a shield would have zero impact on that.



 

Player pool gradually shrinks due to variety of reasons -> game needs new players to survive -> noob protection gets more players hooked -> noob protection is good for game -> end of story.
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You claim you want it "fairer" on YOU, like in the good old days?  Its never been fair.  
You wanted the better planes so you had advantage over others!
You didn't really want it to be fair on THEM. 
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What are you all complaining about? You want the game to be EASIER ???????????? . Easy is boring. 
I suck at hitting stuff, but I keep playing because I like the challenge.
I suspect that most of the top players who leave, leave because it's no longer a challenge. They become bored.
As Pegoud would say "Viva le defi"
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Zup, I suggest you make it even harder for the top level players, then they might stay longer. 
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Gannet post=386369 userid=35923
I suck at hitting stuff, but I keep playing because I like the challenge.

Huh? You keep playing ? ha ha

Gannet post=386369 userid=35923
I suspect that most of the top players who leave, leave because it's no longer a challenge. They become bored.
As Pegoud would say "Viva le defi"
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Gannet post=386369 userid=35923 Zup, I suggest you make it even harder for the top level players, then they might stay longer. 

 

Yes, please and make be a truly challenge to keep paying the subscription.

I don't know why a person who don´t login in game have months or aren't paying any subscription, arrives on forum to complicate the life of the players  who are supporting and active in game.

 

I forgot to mention that in games usually the bosses are the challenge. And the players who start the game, have to find the way to beat them not the other way round.

I will just put in my two cents and what i see. Im not here to try and change anything, this is zupermans app and he can run it however he likes it wont chamge the way i think of the game either way. Sometimes i feel like when players see a noob they think of some young kid who will throw a fit and quit because their shot down too many times or get angry. That is the case sometimes but beleive it or not many of us are adults and umderstand this is just a game. Sure we want to have fun also but we also know that to be good it takes practice. Nothing will come overnight, its obvious that it takes time to reach higher ranks but when i get there i dont want to feel like only made it there because i had a shield, when i get there it would be nice to have gained equal respect from older players because i worked hard and i took the beatings like a real player. In all honesty the shield does not protect us from the real problem. Im rank 10, you can look at my stats and see that im not an outstanding player and i have been in several games with others my same rank who have hovered over the base and killed me over and over as i would leave the ground. These were not high rank players, these were players same rank as me who for some reason could kill me with one or two shots everytime, who for some reason were in the same plane as me but could out turn me....and this was all the time. The shield does not protect a noob against another noob. There are high rank players who abuse, im not going to be a whiner and name any names but the shield does not protect us from them either because they also are excellent shooters and it makes no difference whether the shield is in place or not. You want to know what is sad..? There are also higher rank players who still struggle and that is who this effects the most.....they struggled the entire time they were noob and finaly make it to a rank they can buy better planes and theyre getting kills and then you throw noobs in the game with a shield and now theyre struggling because not only are they still being slaughter by higher rank players who have better devices and experience but now theyre struggling becasue noobs with alot of gaming experience are invinsible...dont get me wrong, im not saying that everyone here is a struggling high rank player, im just saying that the average player is who the shield seems to effect the most, it doesnt effect noob abuser it doesnt effect high rank abusers.....by listening to players chat in game they mostly quit because they can no longer buy planes unless they subscribe....you want to help the noobs feom being abuse but you dont want to let them have a better plane unles they subscribe....i cannot speak for all noob players and they should give thier imput as well but  if i ever quit it will not be from being abused by the majority of high rank players, it will be because i started this awesome game because of the ww1 theme and i am tired of being up against ww2 planes. It isnt realistic, and it is twice as hard to make points because instead of competing against planes the same tier or the same style and speed were competing with planes 3 or 4 times faster....instead of being able to bomb 5 hangers i am lucky to bomb one. Same with carrier, i have been in so mamy missions where i didnt even get to the enemy base and the mission was over because two ww2 planes carrying 4 bombs each finished it. The enmey ww2 planes are at our base before we even get past the tree line. How can we build points that way? How can we ever become good if we arent included in then actual mission? Squad wars should be ww1 only that way noobs and high rank players are all the tier planes and there would be no reason for noobs to be in ww2 server. I didnt mean to write so much but i hope this helps. I will like to say that prerty much all of the daily high rank players have been most helpful...Dunc7, Direwolf, Deez, Pinkstar, Owl, tBiggs, Pegoud stand out the most who give pointers, who leave the game if it is too unbalanced i actualy look forward to them being in game because if there are other noobs spawnkilling they usualy stop when they enter the game. Even the high rank players who abuse know when to stop so they arent seen, they stay at the base a llittle longer than they should. It almost seems to be more of an ethics issue than anything and ethics is not taught with a shield...i dont know what the best solution would be but maybe this will help zuperman make his decision on what to do. Thanks zuperman for all your hard work the new system is great putting squad members together i only wish we were in ww1 all the time.

Wow, was it that long ago I switched to a new account !
Currently I'm flying as "Tui". If you check that you'll see I last flew yesterday.
And you wont see that name much anyway because I'm in a very different  time zone. (and being retired I am far too busy now to spend hours in the game )
Switched for two reasons:
1. I prefer the slower tactical game of the lower tier planes, suits my geriatric reaction times
2. In a slower game the lag I experience on the other side of the world has less impact.
3. Got frustrated being shot up by MORAFs, I also wanted a "fairer" game.
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Forget about making it personal. The logic of my comments stands on its own. Discuss that.

Gannet wrote:

Wow, was it that long ago I switched to a new account !
Currently I'm flying as "Tui". If you check that you'll see I last flew yesterday.
And you wont see that name much anyway because I'm in a very different  time zone. (and being retired I am far too busy now to spend hours in the game

)
Switched for two reasons:
1. I prefer the slower tactical game of the lower tier planes, suits my geriatric reaction times
2. In a slower game the lag I experience on the other side of the world has less impact.
3. Got frustrated being shot up by MORAFs, I also wanted a "fairer" game.

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Forget about making it personal. The logic of my comments stands on its own. Discuss that.

Ok Gannet, if you like to fly ww1 low tier planes, is only pay the subscription to unlock them in your main account, as we did when it was locked. Sorry, but to me it's only proof what I realized in game like " oh i don't want pay sub to fly with my ww1 planes, so I'll keep creating noob accounts and yes get some noob protection for fun" was Tui the player who was camping and  spawnkilling pure noobs using a tank! ? lol 
 

Woah! Touchie touchie! 
You're getting more personal, not less. 
.
Anyway, all False truths. 
Or are you confusing "Tui" with that other guy, "Tiu" 
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I've expressed my thoughts, so I'll  drop out of this thread now, this is going in a rather boring direction,
Have a nice day.

 

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